2019 Renault F1 Team

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djos
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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Honestly I don’t care if you think Cyril Is the only TP who spouts BS propaganda.
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.

Mclarensenna
Mclarensenna
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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djos wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:27 am
Honestly I don’t care if you think Cyril Is the only TP who spouts BS propaganda.
<--------You do care that is why you replied. Nice try with using the word honestly. Yep i believe you now after you caught out in multiple lies previously. Also now you changing the wording from "Cyril makes claims that are on par with the BS from every other team principle." to "other team principals sprout BS." Massive difference now trying to backpedal on your previous statements.

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djos
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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Then Let me be more specific, I don’t care enough to argue the point with you.
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.

Mclarensenna
Mclarensenna
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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Mod edit: <Let's not pick personal fights, folks. Let's talk to each other (past each other is also fine) rather than trying to defeat each other, shall we?>

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diffuser
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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Mclarensenna wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 3:08 am
djos wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 3:00 am
Then Let me be more specific, I don’t care enough to argue the point with you.
When somebody lies over and over again, then changes the wording even as a last ditch attempt he is making 100 times more effort. It takes a lot more effort to make up lies being creative then just dispute your lies with facts which i am doing and caught you out multiple times.
None of that will matter if the 2020 car is very good. If they continue to struggle, he might not see 2021..

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NathanOlder
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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The trouble with that is, by the end of 2020, they may part ways but the damage is already done and Renault are behind on yet another new set of regs. Cyril has to go asap for them to have any chance at being competitive in 2021. Unless Renault started 3 yrs early on a set of regs that weren't finalised hmmmm.....
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Capharol
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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The problem with Abiteboul is...... he wants to act like a big teammanager, but he ain't one
Strive for continuous improvement, instead of perfection.
"Most people seem to turn off their brain when they turn on the computer and log in to social media."

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diffuser
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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NathanOlder wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 9:49 am
The trouble with that is, by the end of 2020, they may part ways but the damage is already done and Renault are behind on yet another new set of regs. Cyril has to go asap for them to have any chance at being competitive in 2021. Unless Renault started 3 yrs early on a set of regs that weren't finalised hmmmm.....
I think he's doing a good job but then I don't sit there dissecting every word he says. He's a manager....he used his engineering knowledge to assess personelle. He doesn't do any design work. So things haven't worked out and they're making changes.

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Big Tea
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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I suppose the thing is, what exactly does Abiteboul do? What does he have control over?
I feel he is often just the mouth and others have control. Ho is not a strategist, so has to take his leads from them, he is not a design engineer so has vhat he gets, he does not even control the purse strings, so there is no "what I say, goes".

I am not an apologist for the guy, just wonder if it is all deserved.
I am very much in favour of filtered water. Preferably passed through a brewery

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diffuser
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:58 pm
I suppose the thing is, what exactly does Abiteboul do? What does he have control over?
I feel he is often just the mouth and others have control. Ho is not a strategist, so has to take his leads from them, he is not a design engineer so has vhat he gets, he does not even control the purse strings, so there is no "what I say, goes".

I am not an apologist for the guy, just wonder if it is all deserved.
Team principal(s)	
Clotilde Delbos (Group CEO (acting))
Jérôme Stoll (President)
Cyril Abiteboul (Managing Director)

Technical director	
Nick Chester (Chassis Technical Director) -Axed (Pat Fry)
Rémi Taffin (Engine Technical Director)
Marcin Budkowski (Executive Director)
Pete Machin (Aerodynamics Chief) -Axed ... Now Dirk de Beer
New Deputy Aerodynamic Manager (unnamed, Vince Todd interim)

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Big Tea
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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diffuser wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:12 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:58 pm
I suppose the thing is, what exactly does Abiteboul do? What does he have control over?
I feel he is often just the mouth and others have control. Ho is not a strategist, so has to take his leads from them, he is not a design engineer so has vhat he gets, he does not even control the purse strings, so there is no "what I say, goes".

I am not an apologist for the guy, just wonder if it is all deserved.
Team principal(s)	
Clotilde Delbos (Group CEO (acting))
Jérôme Stoll (President)
Cyril Abiteboul (Managing Director)

Technical director	
Nick Chester (Chassis Technical Director) -Axed (Pat Fry)
Rémi Taffin (Engine Technical Director)
Marcin Budkowski (Executive Director)
Pete Machin (Aerodynamics Chief) -Axed ... Now Dirk de Beer
New Deputy Aerodynamic Manager (unnamed, Vince Todd interim)
So what exactly does he have (practical) control of? Not engine, Not body, Not design, and he is not a driver.
And such a shy retiring understating guy too
I am very much in favour of filtered water. Preferably passed through a brewery

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Capharol
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:14 pm
diffuser wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:12 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:58 pm
I suppose the thing is, what exactly does Abiteboul do? What does he have control over?
I feel he is often just the mouth and others have control. Ho is not a strategist, so has to take his leads from them, he is not a design engineer so has vhat he gets, he does not even control the purse strings, so there is no "what I say, goes".

I am not an apologist for the guy, just wonder if it is all deserved.
Team principal(s)	
Clotilde Delbos (Group CEO (acting))
Jérôme Stoll (President)
Cyril Abiteboul (Managing Director)

Technical director	
Nick Chester (Chassis Technical Director) -Axed (Pat Fry)
Rémi Taffin (Engine Technical Director)
Marcin Budkowski (Executive Director)
Pete Machin (Aerodynamics Chief) -Axed ... Now Dirk de Beer
New Deputy Aerodynamic Manager (unnamed, Vince Todd interim)
So what exactly does he have (practical) control of? Not engine, Not body, Not design, and he is not a driver.
And such a shy retiring understating guy too
if he has nothing to say but just being there for the interviews and statements, i am willing to take over his position 🤣🤣
Strive for continuous improvement, instead of perfection.
"Most people seem to turn off their brain when they turn on the computer and log in to social media."

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diffuser
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Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2012 12:55 pm
Location: Montreal

Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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Capharol wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 6:00 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:14 pm
diffuser wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:12 pm

Team principal(s)	
Clotilde Delbos (Group CEO (acting))
Jérôme Stoll (President)
Cyril Abiteboul (Managing Director)

Technical director	
Nick Chester (Chassis Technical Director) -Axed (Pat Fry)
Rémi Taffin (Engine Technical Director)
Marcin Budkowski (Executive Director)
Pete Machin (Aerodynamics Chief) -Axed ... Now Dirk de Beer
New Deputy Aerodynamic Manager (unnamed, Vince Todd interim)
So what exactly does he have (practical) control of? Not engine, Not body, Not design, and he is not a driver.
And such a shy retiring understating guy too
if he has nothing to say but just being there for the interviews and statements, i am willing to take over his position 🤣🤣

LOL

Like I said he's an Engineer by education. Probably has a higher level of people skills than the average Engineer while not as technical as the better ones. Those who can't do, manage.

He seems to be the lightning rod for the technical team. Takes the heat while allowing them to stay focused on the technical. Sure he has input on who Marcin Budkowski put in to place but I did notice that the announcements come from Marcin(in other words Fry, Beer & Taffin report directly to Marcin).



Considering everyone is b*tching about Cyril and nobody is saying anything about Marcin ...he's doing a good job.

Mclarensenna
Mclarensenna
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Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2018 1:49 am

Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:14 pm
diffuser wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:12 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:58 pm
I suppose the thing is, what exactly does Abiteboul do? What does he have control over?
I feel he is often just the mouth and others have control. Ho is not a strategist, so has to take his leads from them, he is not a design engineer so has vhat he gets, he does not even control the purse strings, so there is no "what I say, goes".

I am not an apologist for the guy, just wonder if it is all deserved.
Team principal(s)	
Clotilde Delbos (Group CEO (acting))
Jérôme Stoll (President)
Cyril Abiteboul (Managing Director)

Technical director	
Nick Chester (Chassis Technical Director) -Axed (Pat Fry)
Rémi Taffin (Engine Technical Director)
Marcin Budkowski (Executive Director)
Pete Machin (Aerodynamics Chief) -Axed ... Now Dirk de Beer
New Deputy Aerodynamic Manager (unnamed, Vince Todd interim)
So what exactly does he have (practical) control of? Not engine, Not body, Not design, and he is not a driver.
And such a shy retiring understating guy too
You make some very valid points sure.
The problem with Cyril is he is involved in a lot of the decisions that affect everything at Renault F1.
For example in 2014 the Renault engine department had 1/3 the budget, 1/3 the staff and very very old outdated equipment compared to Mercedes and Ferrari.
And he kept saying Renault is very efficient he can do more with less. So he was confident he can win and catch them. This shows complete disconnect from reality in an engine era where budget rules.

Redbull did not believe them nobody did they all said it was impossible to compete under these conditions and budget yet Cyril was so stubborn and adamant he can do it and we saw the results.
It is fantasy wishful thinking not based on reality.
He always keeps citing how Renault won in the Alonso era with less and can do it again.
He does not realise that back then it was slightly less. Figures i saw thrown around back then was 10-20% less.
So he cites this example but tries to do more with 200-300% less now.
yes Redbull can make a better chassis or similar than Merc and Ferrari with 20-30%% less if they have Newey and the best staff.
But even Newey the design genius cannot do it with 200-300% less.

Renault on top does not have a Newey or an Alison. they have inferior staff and he still thinks he can compete with superior staff with VASTLY inferior budgets.
If you listen to Cyril and everything he says the last 5 years you will see he is just not a top level manager like a Toto Wolf or a Christian Horner. The decisions he makes do not seem to make sense in my opinion and all have led to where Renault this year was struggling against a team like Torro Rosso with a vastly inferior budget and vastly inferior drivers.

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JordanMugen
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Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2018 12:36 pm

Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

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Jambier wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:54 am

I am much more afraid of the chassis....

Pat Fry and the chassis team will have to work on 2021 starting now
If Renault can simply fix the
aero flaws of the 2019, they should find a lot of performance simply by getting their existing aero concept to work properly, just as McLaren did between 2018 and 2019.

The wind tunnel recalibration sounds promising, and should get the aero team on the right track to getting accurate correlations.

As to the 2021 car... Of course Renault will be full steam ahead to try to do a Brawn 2009. :) 2021 CFD time is unlimited AFAIK, however processing power is CV restricted.

Regardless, Renault’s goal will to be arrive at Melbourne 2021 with the most highly developed concept on the grid, and duly take pole and victory on the way to WDC and WCC championships. :)