On the same lines of this, there was a hinted at theory going around that Honda (because of the use cylinder cutting often and aggressively) were at the point that they could use excess fuel and dump it into cylinders that are not currently firing which would combust in the exhaust and drive the turbine which would either keep the turbo on song without MGU-H intervention OR have the MGU-H in generator mode and this would boost electrical generation. Obviously this behaviour is prevalent while cornering for the extra saved energy to be used elsewhere.gruntguru wrote: ↑01 Oct 2020, 23:41@Craigy & godlameroso. I appreciate all those points - that's why I said "in an ideal world".
There is another factor following on from godlameroso's post. The race fuel allocation is ample at most tracks (it wouldn't be ample if the flow rate was unlimited). There is a small benefit in starting with less-than-full tanks. There is a bigger benefit in being able to use more of the fuel allocation - effectively. This is another reason to use inefficient strategies like electric supercharger and "retarded timing exhaust harvest".
Worth remembering - over the course of the race:
Total drivetrain energy to the tyres = (Total fuel energy burned x average PU conversion efficiency) + (Braking energy harvested x recycling efficiency).
This is a very exciting and dramatic. But not desireable in this formula. Fuel is liquid gold. High quality energy that must be burned to extract every Joule. Why dump it into a low efficiency process?GhostF1 wrote: ↑02 Oct 2020, 01:50On the same lines of this, there was a hinted at theory going around that Honda (because of the use cylinder cutting often and aggressively) were at the point that they could use excess fuel and dump it into cylinders that are not currently firing which would combust in the exhaust and drive the turbine which would either keep the turbo on song without MGU-H intervention OR have the MGU-H in generator mode and this would boost electrical generation. Obviously this behaviour is prevalent while cornering for the extra saved energy to be used elsewhere.gruntguru wrote: ↑01 Oct 2020, 23:41@Craigy & godlameroso. I appreciate all those points - that's why I said "in an ideal world".
There is another factor following on from godlameroso's post. The race fuel allocation is ample at most tracks (it wouldn't be ample if the flow rate was unlimited). There is a small benefit in starting with less-than-full tanks. There is a bigger benefit in being able to use more of the fuel allocation - effectively. This is another reason to use inefficient strategies like electric supercharger and "retarded timing exhaust harvest".
Worth remembering - over the course of the race:
Total drivetrain energy to the tyres = (Total fuel energy burned x average PU conversion efficiency) + (Braking energy harvested x recycling efficiency).
Do you know design of honda mgu-h/turbo? Maybe it contains some kind of compression area or hotter part where they want to burn fuel, to combust fuel reached there unburnedPlatinumZealot wrote: ↑02 Oct 2020, 07:26This is a very exciting and dramatic. But not desireable in this formula. Fuel is liquid gold. High quality energy that must be burned to extract every Joule. Why dump it into a low efficiency process?GhostF1 wrote: ↑02 Oct 2020, 01:50On the same lines of this, there was a hinted at theory going around that Honda (because of the use cylinder cutting often and aggressively) were at the point that they could use excess fuel and dump it into cylinders that are not currently firing which would combust in the exhaust and drive the turbine which would either keep the turbo on song without MGU-H intervention OR have the MGU-H in generator mode and this would boost electrical generation. Obviously this behaviour is prevalent while cornering for the extra saved energy to be used elsewhere.gruntguru wrote: ↑01 Oct 2020, 23:41@Craigy & godlameroso. I appreciate all those points - that's why I said "in an ideal world".
There is another factor following on from godlameroso's post. The race fuel allocation is ample at most tracks (it wouldn't be ample if the flow rate was unlimited). There is a small benefit in starting with less-than-full tanks. There is a bigger benefit in being able to use more of the fuel allocation - effectively. This is another reason to use inefficient strategies like electric supercharger and "retarded timing exhaust harvest".
Worth remembering - over the course of the race:
Total drivetrain energy to the tyres = (Total fuel energy burned x average PU conversion efficiency) + (Braking energy harvested x recycling efficiency).
Remember.. The turbine is not designed as a combustion chamber. There is no containment or flame holding or mixing.. You know what that means.. Giant flames and black smoke shooting out the back (watch 1980's F1 when they ran rich in qualifying!) .. We don't see this today.
It is not effective at low turbine rpm to harvest
either. Best to harvest with MGUH at high rpm as the MGUH voltage is higher and there are less electrical losses.
Think about this scenario...
Braking into corners... Engine power goes down, turbine speed goes down... You are charging at near max current with MGUK. And you can afford to charge using MGUH as compressor flow is now restricted anyway.
Why the mad rush now to dump fuel into the exhaust? I think dumping fuel is not productive when you have free air from the engine as an air pump as it decelerates.
Also explosions inside the turbine is also bad for the life of the turbo charger. The blades have to be loaded against the explosions.
I don't think this is happening.
Very likely it could be cylinder cutting and thus a mix cold blowing on the unfired cylinders. The throttle opening is the same for all cylinders i believe. You can't lock the unfrmired cylinders; they will be pumping air. And this is the sound of that I think.
https://youtu.be/M9bMGzQZ00g