Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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the EDGE
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Phil wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:46 am
It's amusing to see how many are willing to draw definite conclusions on Russel vs Bottas based on 1 race. This could very well have been Russels best showing and Bottas worst. Bottas has had many races against Lewis where he has outperformed Lewis and races where he completely lost it. This doesn't mean that Russel would be any better than Bottas at challenging Hamilton on a consistent basis, race in, race out, across an entire season. Few have proven to be a match in those terms.
People will take any chance they can to knock down someone they (or their own favourite driver) feel threatened by, it’s basic human instinct

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nzjrs
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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the EDGE wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:50 am
Phil wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:46 am
It's amusing to see how many are willing to draw definite conclusions on Russel vs Bottas based on 1 race. This could very well have been Russels best showing and Bottas worst. Bottas has had many races against Lewis where he has outperformed Lewis and races where he completely lost it. This doesn't mean that Russel would be any better than Bottas at challenging Hamilton on a consistent basis, race in, race out, across an entire season. Few have proven to be a match in those terms.
People will take any chance they can to knock down someone they (or their own favourite driver) feel threatened by, it’s basic human instinct
It's half human nature, and half tactics - driver agument threads are toxic because the dynamics also work in the other direction too. People (like the drivers themselves) always talk-up their teammate so it makes their achievements bettering them seem greater.

KeiKo403
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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So thats the 2021 grid complete then! Hamilton stays, maybe for just this 1 year. Will we maybe see a Bottas 4.5 (don't know what version we're actually on sorry) He technically has nothing to lose other than his 'nice guy' reputation, I wonder if the nice guy legacy means more to him than beating Hamilton to a WDC in the same machinery.

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RedNEO
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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RedNEO wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 2:23 pm
BREAKING - Mercedes will sign Hamilton for 2021 but keeping open about 2022 and beyond
Hamilton does not get a three-year contract
Formula 1 world champion Lewis Hamilton will not sign a three-year contract with Mercedes. "I don't think so," said Mercedes Motorsport Director Toto Wolff in an exclusive interview with RTL / ntv. Because of the budget cap that has been in effect since this year and the new F1 rules from 2022, the team has to "keep your eyes open", according to the Austrian.

However, Hamilton will "soon" sign a new working paper and also drive for the Silver Arrows in 2021, assured Wolff. In the end there must be a "sensible agreement, and we are not far from it". Wolff explains in the video what makes the negotiations so complicated.
https://www.rtl.de/cms/lewis-hamilton-f ... ssion=true

Looks like they’ve got a pick of either Max or George or both for 2022. Lewis might not wanna stick around for that fight especially being on a lower salary. Bottas definitely out for 2022.
And there it is..

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214270
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Phil wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:46 am
It's amusing to see how many are willing to draw definite conclusions on Russel vs Bottas based on 1 race. This could very well have been Russels best showing and Bottas worst. Bottas has had many races against Lewis where he has outperformed Lewis and races where he completely lost it. This doesn't mean that Russel would be any better than Bottas at challenging Hamilton on a consistent basis, race in, race out, across an entire season. Few have proven to be a match in those terms.
Yeah, I’ve come down on RUS since Sakhir. I know Marko likes to sh*t stir, but it’s hard to argue with this:

https://www.planetf1.com/news/helmut-ma ... l-verdict/

Then if you dig into the numbers a bit the stint on the harder tyre was pretty bad. Sakhir had way too short a lap length to be deficient vs. your teammate to the tune of 3.5 tenths approx.

https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files ... rt_v01.pdf
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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One season contract for Hamilton. Let the silly season be even more silly why dontcha.
.. ... ... ... ...

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Scorpaguy
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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I would have thought a 1-yr extension was to be what should be expected due to a number of factors. Mostly, 2020 was a "strange year" and 2021 shows little sign of becoming less strange. Lewis, has "GOAT" reputation to uphold...well deserved IMHO. With F1 being a bit strange in the best of times, 2021 can bring lots of unknowns. This 1-year deal has Ham residing in a familiar setting, fast car, amiable team-mate. The press on the contract delay was doing him no favors...and either pushing for/or agreeing to a single year deal was a no-brainer. Thus, we can all look forward to #8 (bemoaning the lack of interest at the frond of the grid), and Ham can see what his bargaining position is for another extension in 10 months.

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adrianjordan
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Quotes from Toto on BBC suggest that they agreed only 1 year because time was running out and this allows them to spend longer looking after 2022 onwards.
Lando Norris: "Such a great driver"
Daniel Ricciardo: "Darren" 🤣

Ringleheim
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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KeiKo403 wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 1:30 pm
So thats the 2021 grid complete then! Hamilton stays, maybe for just this 1 year. Will we maybe see a Bottas 4.5 (don't know what version we're actually on sorry) He technically has nothing to lose other than his 'nice guy' reputation, I wonder if the nice guy legacy means more to him than beating Hamilton to a WDC in the same machinery.
I assume the highlighted text was a joke.

No chance in hell of this being the case.

He is probably actively trying to get rid of the "nice guy" label, as that amounts to "loser" in professional sports.

His problem is that he is a nice guy and gentleman by nature! As far as I can tell at least.

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Schuttelberg
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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adrianjordan wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 10:12 pm
Quotes from Toto on BBC suggest that they agreed only 1 year because time was running out and this allows them to spend longer looking after 2022 onwards.
I think I would not believe a word that comes out of Toto's mouth. He holds all the aces. If I were Lewis, I'd definitely look at other options for 2022, just in case. Also, depends on whether he wants to race.

People are just talking about Russell, but Mercedes have a ready replacement for Bottas too in Ocon who's up for selection in 2022.

I think it'll be a Russell/Hamilton partnership but if Hamilton decides to be done, I think Ocon is reasonably placed to take the second Mercedes drive.

People are obsessed with Merc and Max but I think Max and Charles both will not move till they see what sort of car their current teams have made for 2022.

If the 4 options to Mercedes are not enough, there's always Seb at Aston who they have ties with and a Vettel/Russell line up isn't something out of the realms of possibility in my opinion.
"Sebastian there's very, you're a member of a very select few.. Stewart, Lauda, Piquet, Senna, Prost, Schumacher, Fangio.. VETTEL!"

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langedweil
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Schuttelberg wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 10:29 pm
People are just talking about Russell, but Mercedes have a ready replacement for Bottas too in Ocon who's up for selection in 2022.

I just have this feeling this year will be Ocon's last year in F1; he was tried, he didn't weigh up, move on ..
HuggaWugga !

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raymondu999
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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So...

Polling time. Will (not would/could/should) Hamilton continue above 2021? I think he will cash out on his 8th title and retire from F1.

Thoughts?
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JordanMugen
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Scorpaguy wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 5:58 pm
This 1-year deal has Ham residing in a familiar setting, fast car, amiable team-mate.
Most unfortunate. :|

Oh well, assuming Hamilton will retire with 8xWDC (and will thus never race alongside Russell or Verstappen, in a 2022 Mercedes that may or may not be the best in field, which is a shame), people seem to expect the 2022 Mercedes lineup to be Russell/Verstappen or Russell/Bottas.

However, what if the line-up is Russell/Ocon? Ocon has been consistent against Ricciardo, and will probably be not too far off Alonso too, so it would be a chance finally for the Mercedes junior program to be useful to Mercedes GP Petronas and have two Mercedes (not-so-)juniors in the car! =D>

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JordanMugen
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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raymondu999 wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:10 am
Will (not would/could/should) Hamilton continue above 2021?
Doubtful. Retire on top. Why slug it out tooth and nail against Russell, in a new regulation car that may not even be the best? Such a shame for the fans, that the tooth and nail battle with Russell could have been this year and for a WDC, but Mercedes inexplicably re-signed Bottas early on against all logic. :cry:

One thing is for sure: Russell's 2022-2024 3-year Mercedes deal should be announced ASAP, there is no reason to delay that announcement. Probability of Bottas suddenly driving much better, defeating Hamilton and winning the 2021 WDC and being retained is almost zero IMO.

Whether Hamilton, Ocon or other (Norris!? :D ) will drive the other Mercedes is something to decide later. :)

Meanwhile if Verstappen decides to try Mercedes (even with the budget cap and reduced wind tunnel allocation), that really puts Red Bull Racing in a pickle! :shock: Ricciardo is contracted for 2022, Alonso likewise, obtaining Norris would be difficult, as would obtaining Russell... Surely they won't put Gasly or Tsunoda or Albon alongside Perez? I guess Red Bull could bide their time with a Perez + Hulkenberg/Magnuessen/Grosjean lineup. :shock:

Edit -- Oops, I actually forgot about Vettel w.r.t. Red Bull or Mercedes, such is the high estimation the 4xWDC is (not) held in! :shock:
Last edited by JordanMugen on Tue Feb 09, 2021 3:20 am, edited 3 times in total.

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JordanMugen
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Ringleheim wrote:
Mon Feb 08, 2021 10:24 pm
He is probably actively trying to get rid of the "nice guy" label, as that amounts to "loser" in professional sports.

His problem is that he is a nice guy and gentleman by nature! As far as I can tell at least.
So Bottas ought to close the door aggressively, forcing rivals to the grass/concrete (ala Mr. Mazepin) and/or cause some collisions on purpose? The 12 FIA penalty points should be Bottas' target rather than an allowance, eh? ;) He could certainly try that. But this requires being ahead of Hamilton on track, and Hamilton not being able to beat Bottas without overtaking by simply running long and using the overcut and so on.