2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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El Scorchio
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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Here’s one. (and apologies if it’s been discussed and I missed it.) Been thinking about it since earlier and I genuinely don’t know the answer.

If Perez pulled over on the formation lap and then went into the pits at the end of the same lap, while all the other cars went round an additional formation lap which officially counted as lap one of the race- in effect lapping him, shouldn’t Perez have started one lap down on everyone else rather than the same lap? I really don’t know the rules surrounding it and whether there’s an allowance but I’m sure Perez only did 56 laps while everyone else did 57?

tangodjango
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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El Scorchio wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 6:38 pm
lh13 wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 6:06 pm
El Scorchio wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 6:00 pm


The cars aren’t very, very close mate. The Red Bull is clearly faster. Nice try (again) though.
You are exaggerating. Today's race showed cars are close indeed.
Sorry, but no. If the Mercedes is on pole by 0.4 seconds then you’ll be among the first people to say how much of a better car it is than any other. Now the situation is reversed and it’s ‘very very close’ between the cars. Come on.
Yeah man agree with you. The garbage people have been spewing about Hamilton for ages is just diabolical. Now they were basically stuffed today the same crowd is resorting to 'race pace' arguments.
“Hamilton’s talent is perhaps even more than that of Ayrton or Schumacher or Fernando." - Rubens Barrichello

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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zibby43 wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:12 pm

Both teams will have tough decisions this year though, as these cars are development dead ends.
Is it a tough decision? This year, currently, both are in with a good chance of the title(s). Next year, they might fluff it anyway and then be behind the front end of the grid. So it's a good chance this year or a possible chance next.

Or: Jam today, jam tomorrow.

I think Mercedes will want to get the title this year because, if for no other reason, it would mean they had all of the titles for this particular era. That is unheard of in the history of F1, isn't it? So they may be prepared to risk next year if it gets them this year in the bag.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

bonjon1979
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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El Scorchio wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:34 pm
Here’s one. (and apologies if it’s been discussed and I missed it.) Been thinking about it since earlier and I genuinely don’t know the answer.

If Perez pulled over on the formation lap and then went into the pits at the end of the same lap, while all the other cars went round an additional formation lap which officially counted as lap one of the race- in effect lapping him, shouldn’t Perez have started one lap down on everyone else rather than the same lap? I really don’t know the rules surrounding it and whether there’s an allowance but I’m sure Perez only did 56 laps while everyone else did 57?
I thought exactly the same.

Edax
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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zibby43 wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:08 pm

This is correct. Version 2 of the Race Director’s notes specifically states that T4 was not going to be monitored during the race.

After the radio call, it did start to get monitored (which is crazy), and both teams complied henceforth.

But the overtake had nothing to do with T4’s monitoring status. Completely separate issue. That pass would’ve been disallowed at every corner.

Credit to Max for going for it at least, and being a good sport about it afterward when it was correctly decided.
I thought it was rather messy (as usual). The white line should be the edge of the track. Then it is clear. But now it sometimes the line is used, sometimes the edge of the curbstone, and in this case it seemed to be an arbitrary distance from the curbstones.

Concur with the last comment, 4 years ago Ves would have either:
A) driven Ham front wing off when entering the corner, and damaged his own floor.
B) ignored the teams request to give the place back.
C) made a big stink on the podium.
Or more likely a combination of these three.

The fact that he didn’t, shows how far he has come. And frankly is more pleasant to watch.

Anyway. It was a good race, I enjoyed it. The drivers enjoyed it. What more can you ask for.

Mchamilton
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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El Scorchio wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:34 pm
Here’s one. (and apologies if it’s been discussed and I missed it.) Been thinking about it since earlier and I genuinely don’t know the answer.

If Perez pulled over on the formation lap and then went into the pits at the end of the same lap, while all the other cars went round an additional formation lap which officially counted as lap one of the race- in effect lapping him, shouldn’t Perez have started one lap down on everyone else rather than the same lap? I really don’t know the rules surrounding it and whether there’s an allowance but I’m sure Perez only did 56 laps while everyone else did 57?
The race hadn't started, so no he isn't a lap down. They count the lap really for the sole reason that the cars could no longer do the race distance otherwise, due to being fueled for a specific distance.

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El Scorchio
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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Mchamilton wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 10:18 pm
El Scorchio wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:34 pm
Here’s one. (and apologies if it’s been discussed and I missed it.) Been thinking about it since earlier and I genuinely don’t know the answer.

If Perez pulled over on the formation lap and then went into the pits at the end of the same lap, while all the other cars went round an additional formation lap which officially counted as lap one of the race- in effect lapping him, shouldn’t Perez have started one lap down on everyone else rather than the same lap? I really don’t know the rules surrounding it and whether there’s an allowance but I’m sure Perez only did 56 laps while everyone else did 57?
The race hadn't started, so no he isn't a lap down. They count the lap really for the sole reason that the cars could no longer do the race distance otherwise, due to being fueled for a specific distance.
Thanks! Makes sense. You could argue he then has the advantage of ever so slightly less worn tyres and the ability to use a little more fuel over the race, but of course that’s offset by fractionally more fuel weight he has to carry, along with of course the huge disadvantage of starting from the pit Lane!

Interesting quirk of the rules with that extra formation lap counting but yet not counting at the same time.

zibby43
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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Just_a_fan wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:58 pm
zibby43 wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:12 pm

Both teams will have tough decisions this year though, as these cars are development dead ends.
Is it a tough decision? This year, currently, both are in with a good chance of the title(s). Next year, they might fluff it anyway and then be behind the front end of the grid. So it's a good chance this year or a possible chance next.

Or: Jam today, jam tomorrow.

I think Mercedes will want to get the title this year because, if for no other reason, it would mean they had all of the titles for this particular era. That is unheard of in the history of F1, isn't it? So they may be prepared to risk next year if it gets them this year in the bag.
All good points!

There’s always that risk of missing out on that one big advantage (whether it be on the aero or PU side) when new rules come into effect though, and that can put someone in a tough hole to dig out of early. Especially considering the development rate is going to be pretty frenetic early on.

siskue2005
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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Leclerc confirms drivers were told there would be no penalty for going off the circuit at turn 4

interesting; so it was only redbull and max who didnt know about this!

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AMG.Tzan
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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siskue2005 wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 10:32 pm


Leclerc confirms drivers were told there would be no penalty for going off the circuit at turn 4

interesting
Norris just after Leclerc said that the stewards were clear that you will get a penalty only if you gain an advantage while passing someone in turn 4...like Verstappen did when passing Hamilton! Not if you just go beyond the kerbs without passing someone!

The thing i can't understand is why they told Lewis to stop cutting turn 4 since he wasn't passing anyone there?
"The only rule is there are no rules" - Aristotle Onassis

Nathanael F1
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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Most technologically advanced sport in the world, but can’t consistently decide where the track ends and enforce warnings/penalties accordingly!
Favorite Team: Scuderia Ferrari
Favorite Driver: Nico Hülkenberg

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Scorpaguy
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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Same thing, different day:

-Ham's tyres "won't last"...but do.
-Bot is now fully focused and on a WDC mission...but is not.
-Red bull is close...but no cigar.
-Big Red is slow...maybe slower (funny that they were celebrating a 6th and 8th).
-Vet "was finished"...and still is.
-Fred's talent would conquer all...but does not.
-Williams will suck...they do not disappoint.
-Danny Ric...yep, "that train has left the station".
-Alfa was invisible...did they race today?

Some things that may be different:
-Does RB now have 2 drivers?
-Tsu...maybe the real deal?
-Maz..maybe even worse than predicted?
-Haas worked hard all winter to get worse...apparently, much harder than we thought

Some of those are pretty savage, but it seems deja vu all over again. At least Max made it close, but Team Merc are just better than the rest...driver (singular), equipment, and Team.

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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Edax wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 10:15 pm


Concur with the last comment, 4 years ago Ves would have either:
A) driven Ham front wing off when entering the corner, and damaged his own floor.
B) ignored the teams request to give the place back.
C) made a big stink on the podium.
Or more likely a combination of these three.

The fact that he didn’t, shows how far he has come. And frankly is more pleasant to watch.

Anyway. It was a good race, I enjoyed it. The drivers enjoyed it. What more can you ask for.
4 years ago, Max was still a teenager. That's a mad thought, isn't it? And teenagers aren't always the most reliable people. But now Max has grown up and is no longer a teenager. He has matured and that showed today. Sure, his little thing about just taking the 5 second penalty instead of handing back the place was a bit silly but it was adrenaline talking. After the race, he was very calm and considered.

I bet we don't see Max make the same mistake next time. He'll either stay on track or he'll give the place back and then reattack without being told to by the race director. Next time, Max will win that race.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

piast9
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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Changing the subject, it is certainly too early to judge definitively, but I have the impression that Stroll senior will regret the money spent on hiring Vettel ...

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AMG.Tzan
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Re: 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, March 26 - 28

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On the Vettel front...

I just can't understand how this man has ended up in this miserable situation since 2019! His crash today was so stupid...same as with Verstappen at Silverstone in 2019!

I was hoping that Aston Martin will help him get back up to his old self...but with this kind of incidents I get the feeling Seb is past his best a long time now! Being beaten by Stroll will just end his career much sooner! In the meantime just look at Perez and how he managed to get back up to 5th by the end...although his Quali was awful I expect him to get up to speed in due time!
"The only rule is there are no rules" - Aristotle Onassis