2021 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, July 30 - Aug 01

[dans79]

Well by that metric, Verstappen should have passed Mick much much earlier too given how much pace advantage the Red Bull had over the Haas even with the damage to his car. After a lap and a half from his pass he was already 3+ secs ahead of Mick.

Why are you talking sense?
Verstappen doesnt make mistakes!!
Let's ask the legendary Mick how he was able to keep a 3 second per lap faster Max behind.

Get a grip.

What is he to get a grip of, he is just pointing out the hypocrisy of some people's posts over the last 48 hours or so.

[Tvetovnato]

Alonso was smart enough take advantage of those errors and make overtaking difficult with his own skills.

I find it a bit rich that Alonso seems to know how Lewis should have been driving those last few corners. He has zero know-how on how the Mercedes corners when following his car. Lewis is known for taking different lines when following drivers on such a track precisely to reduce the dirty air and the effect it has on the frontend of his car.

Considering Hamilton got pole and knows how to maximize laptime on this track, i find it laughable to suggest he was making mistakes in that sector. He was driving those corners differently and due to the effect of the dirty air.

It’s always really cool to be onboard with Lewis in battles, to see how he places the car to avoid the dirty air, either slightly tighter than the racing line or slightly wider. He tried all combos against Fernando, but the Alpine was quite good out of the last corner.

That is surely also due to Alonso being an expert in making sure he is prioritising to be quick in the exactly right parts of the track when battling. I remember at Hockenheim 2012 when he had a much quicker Button behind him. He said after the race that he deliberately slowed down in the last half of the lap in order to save the tires enough to have a perfect run out of turns 2/3 onto the back straight. Amazingly enough he managed to win the race by that. Such a smart driver!

[Andres125sx]

Alonso defended incredibly well, and Lewis didn't want to take any undue risks because it was a good opportunity to make gains on Verstappen in the championship. Don't think we need any more explanation than that.

Add to that Lewis condition wich IMHO is the reason he was making small mistakes in last corner cementing Alonso´s defence.

Anyhow it was so entertaining I don´t care about the reasons, that was great racing by both and I really did enjoy it

[Andres125sx]

Alonso and Hamilton to me is the true heir after shumacher. I rate both at the highest level. But as much as Lewis downplays his tyre wear and plays mind games Alonso also hypes himself and plays mind games. Theyre two sides to the same coin. He did a very great job defending but he knows its not puzzling why Lewis could not pass. They tyre advantage was not big enough. Second Alonso knows why he lost the championship in 2010. He could not overtake A Vitaly Petrov in a much much slower car in Abudahbi, an easier place to overtake.

Alonso is very good. supreme car control and unrelenting time attack skills. But his own hype is something that's hard for him to resist. I do not mind, i enjoy his sense of motivation and humour. But his defense was not an impossible defense.

The most impossible in recent memory is the duel in the desert with Lewis on old slower tyres and Nico on fresher tyres.

So a Mercedes with 5 laps old medium tires does not have enough tire advantage versus an Alpine with 15 laps old hard tires? Sorry but this is BS, that is a huge tire advantage even without considering the car advantage wich adds to this.

Okay then if what you are saying is true.. Then why did not Lewis have enough pace to be on Alonso's gearbox on the end of straight?

Alonso replied that for you just after the race for the spanish tv. He said Lewis should have pass him as fast as he did with Sainz, but he was making small mistakes in last corner and that was the reason he needed so many laps.

Obviously he was another reason himself, but at 40 Alonso is a lot more humble than he used to be. Better late than never

[Ryar]

Comparison with Monaco is deceiving. Despite all that explanation, around 2 seconds advantage (I couldn't find a quote from Sky when they mentioned this) is all that is needed to pass a car in Hungaroring. That Mercedes car at that stage, had more than enough, accounting for both car's pace advantage plus tyres.

Well by that metric, Verstappen should have passed Mick much much earlier too given how much pace advantage the Red Bull had over the Haas even with the damage to his car. After a lap and a half from his pass he was already 3+ secs ahead of Mick.

Why are you talking sense?
Verstappen doesnt make mistakes!!
Let's ask the legendary Mick how he was able to keep a 3 second per lap faster Max behind.

True, why am I talking sense! Where is this 3 second per lap faster Max coming from? Because Mick was being overtaken by other cars and he was getting compromised. He put a brave front against Max, but couldn't do so against Gasly and Hamilton. Sense? Hell of a job there from Max, with a broken and unpredictable car to make such good moves!

[Magicsenna_41]

Mick and Max sounds nice

[Ryar]

Mick and Max sounds nice

Schumacher/Verstappen would have sounded Benetton.

[Just_a_fan]

Mick and Max sounds nice

Schumacher/Verstappen would have sounded Benetton.

Ah, the old combustible Benetton days...



Back when abusing the rules had real consequences.

[jjn9128]

Mick and Max sounds nice

Schumacher/Verstappen would have sounded Benetton.

Ah, the old combustible Benetton days...

https://media.nu.nl/m/qsqxa1oa9zim_wd12 ... ule-1.jpg

Back when abusing the rules had real consequences.

Not really. They could/should arguably have been DSQd for modifying the filter and that's before the traction and launch control (but they never used it, honest) saga.

[Just_a_fan]

Schumacher/Verstappen would have sounded Benetton.

Ah, the old combustible Benetton days...

https://media.nu.nl/m/qsqxa1oa9zim_wd12 ... ule-1.jpg

Back when abusing the rules had real consequences.

Not really. They could/should arguably have been DSQd for modifying the filter and that's before the traction and launch control (but they never used it, honest) saga.

The fire was a consequence of their actions. That they weren't thrown out by the FIA is a different matter. What was shocking was that it came in the same year that two drivers died. It was almost as if the FIA didn't want yet another issue.

[ringo]

Alonso replied that for you just after the race for the spanish tv. He said Lewis should have pass him as fast as he did with Sainz, but he was making small mistakes in last corner and that was the reason he needed so many laps.

Obviously he was another reason himself, but at 40 Alonso is a lot more humble than he used to be. Better late than never

As Phil said, Alonso is just being a bit rich. He does not know what was happening in Lewis car or how Lewis was driving. There were no mistakes. Get over it.
Alonso was the only one who made a silly mistake in the race by crumbling under pressure. And that's fine. He did a good enough job for 10 laps.
We do not hear Lewis, nor mercedes nor chandok or any of the analyst talking about mistakes. Jolyon Palmer should be looking at it hopefully, but no mistakes were obvious to us who could see all of Lewis' car. Alonso could see nothing but the big screens. And it's his screen watching and his obsession with being relevant that caused his error into turn 1.
Driver's make mistakes. Lewis has made many. It's life, but no.. none were made when racing Alonso.
Alonso's tyres were simply good enough to allow him not be overtaken on the straight or under braking.

[Incognito]

True, why am I talking sense! Where is this 3 second per lap faster Max coming from?

Lap 50 to lap 60, when Verstappen was on 20 lap younger tyres than a season-long struggling Riccardo who was also driving a damaged car? Verstappen passed Ricciardo and, by the end of the lap, was 2.8 clear. By lap 66 he was over 22 seconds clear.

The reason no one is saying 'Verstappen sucks!' is because it's a very difficult track to overtake on and Ricciardo is a pretty handy driver, as Verstappen knows better than most. That Verstappen overtook him at all is a sign of how good a driver he is and also how well Ricciardo drove.

The same things people are saying about Hamilton and Alonso.

It's just a shame we didn't get the Verstappen / Ricciardo battle on-camera. There's even a good parallel in the history between the drivers.

[adrianjordan]

Hamilton has long Covid,

... I don't think you can or should say that as written ...

OK, I accept perhaps I should have added a conditional phrase as well.

Just getting very tired of all the armchair medical experts that the last 18 months has produced!! Some of us work bloody hard for a number of years studying to get a degree in that stuff!!

[Michelangelo]

Every Lewis fan is trying to find something that praises Lewis rather than accepting that he couldn't pass Alonso for like 10 laps. Alonso defended well BUT he cracked under pressure. Alonso defended well BUT tyre advantage wasn't that big etc. Hamilton had a faster car and couldn't overtake Fernando. That's it.
And for the Abu Dhabi 2010 example, DRS wasn't a thing back then and that Renault stormed out of slow corners with a traction and had respectable straight line speed. Alonso didn't lose the title because he couldn't overtake. He lost it because of Ferrari's horrible strategy decision. If DRS wasn't a thing, Lewis wouldn't have a chance to pass him.

[Big Tea]

Every Lewis fan is trying to find something that praises Lewis rather than accepting that he couldn't pass Alonso for like 10 laps. Alonso defended well BUT he cracked under pressure. Alonso defended well BUT tyre advantage wasn't that big etc. Hamilton had a faster car and couldn't overtake Fernando. That's it.
And for the Abu Dhabi 2010 example, DRS wasn't a thing back then and that Renault stormed out of slow corners with a traction and had respectable straight line speed. Alonso didn't lose the title because he couldn't overtake. He lost it because of Ferrari's horrible strategy decision. If DRS wasn't a thing, Lewis wouldn't have a chance to pass him.

I see no need for excuses, this is what racing is supposed to be. Places have to be fought for, not zoom up and fly past, that's just driving the quickest car. I also feel, for the same reason, blue flags are far too restrictive. Lapped cars should not hold up leaders unduly, but he 'jump out the way when you are 3 seconds infront' is just spoiling the spectacle for us and the race for any car that is not in the to p3. Notice that when a tail ender starts out of position they 'hold their own' for quite a long while. Not because they are faster than normal, but because they can take the same line as the leaders.

More of this please.