Alonso full of mistakes.

[Rob W]

As myurr, pup and many others have said above, there is no questions about the ruling. People who continue to argue along the lines of Bob forced him off the track etc are on a hiding to nothing.

Alonso only made the pass stick by going completely off the track. End of story. All other details are irrelevant in this specific punishment. If Kubica had done something like break-test, weave wildly etc then, sure, there might be another issue to look at, but Alonso's actions still entailed intervention.

Charlie Whiting has come out and said "We told Ferrari three times that in my opinion they should give the position back to Kubica...". I very much doubt in years gone by teams would have been given such a flashing neon lights heads-up before the steward process began.

Frankly it boggles me that Ferrari were so stupid.

[ISLAMATRON]

They werent stupid(yes they were).. they were trying to cheat... they have gotten away with so much cheating in the past that they just assume they can still get away with it... cheating is a force of habit for them, they are just flabergasted that their weak(and false) excuse that Kubica pushed them off track didnt stick like it has in the past.

Soon we'll hear some(more) stupid remarks from Luca M. and probably a threat to leave F1 and start a breakaway series

[Richard]

We can't have penalties dished out every time a car goes off tack. It would destroy any racing, just as we saw throughout the 08 season.

The lead car has the right to hold its line. I'd prefer to give benefit of the doubt to the lead car. If a chasing car decides to make a move, then it is up to the driver to make it stick. Failure to make it stick (ie going off road) means that they have to go back and try again. The chasing car can't hurtle out of control alongside and expect everyone else to get out of the way.

Regarding Alonso/Kubica, I wonder if Kubica has learnt from his tussle in Canada with Schumacher. Remember they both went off track on that occasion. If Kubica has stayed on track then Schumi would have been penalised. At Silverstone, Kubica kept to his line, didn't yield, and Alonso lost out.

I think Sutl could have done the same with Vettel, he needed to close the door slightly earlier to put Vettel into the same scenario as Alonso. Does anyone know how they tackled that corner in the preceding laps? I wonder if Vettel had previously attacked Sutl on the other side in that sequence of bends? That might explain why he didn't anticipate Vettel making his move.

We also have to appreciate that this was a last lap "all or nothing" move. Alonso tried the same in Valencia and ended up conceding places.

Its a gamble taken by the chasing car, not the lead car.


edit to add ....

Getting back to the OP - What is does show is that Alsonso (and Vettel) have bravado. I suspect that the bravado is given more prominence when other things aren't working out.

[Agenda_Is_Incorrect]

RB knew this and are winding Ferrari up as part of their second half of season plan to disrupt the opposition using Alonsos Latin temprement to ensure a bad drive when under stress.

A bad drive under stress like in 05, 06, 08 and many times this year? McLaren couldn't get right with the blow diffuser and they are not Latin. Faking conspiracy and having prejudice are a "good" combination.

Balance problems with the blown diffuser, a Red Bull conspiracy or being Latin were not the problem. Alonso simply refused to slow down and chose to go outside the track. He didn't give back the position and got punished as he should. It was a mistake that cost him and one teams and drivers do all the time. That's not nice really, but if you call someone cheater because of that then every team there is a cheater (including beloved Hamilton).

[siskue2005]

As myurr, pup and many others have said above, there is no questions about the ruling. People who continue to argue along the lines of Bob forced him off the track etc are on a hiding to nothing.

Alonso only made the pass stick by going completely off the track. End of story. All other details are irrelevant in this specific punishment. If Kubica had done something like break-test, weave wildly etc then, sure, there might be another issue to look at, but Alonso's actions still entailed intervention.

Charlie Whiting has come out and said "We told Ferrari three times that in my opinion they should give the position back to Kubica...". I very much doubt in years gone by teams would have been given such a flashing neon lights heads-up before the steward process began.

Frankly it boggles me that Ferrari were so stupid.

+1

[andrew]

Alonso gained a position by going off the track. The position of Kubica's car is irrelevant.

so for you forcing drivers off track when exactly side by side is OK?

I don't beleve I said or hinted at that. My comment says what it says with no alternative meaning. Please do not put words in my mouth like that. [-X

The simple fact is Alonso passed by going off the track. He was obliged to give the place back but failed to do so. Tough luck Alonso! The End.