2016 Russian Grand Prix - Sochi, Apr. 29 - May 01

[A-Bap]

No sense whatsoever in what you just wrote. Also, there was no race in turkey in 2012.

OK, dear fellow: Turkey, 2011.

[ME4ME]

Fact 1: Turn 1 (OK, Turn 2, really): Vettel stabbed his brakes. Why? Because he tried to dive underneath Massa . At race start, turn-one lock-ups and bumps are both regular and expected. Nothing new here.

That's how it works at the start: a quick run for the first corner, and brake late, hard, and win position. If there are bumps on track, Kvyat would have known and should've accounted for that. Rookie mistake. He admits so himself, no reason to make up excuses for him.

[dans79]

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns33727.html

Dr Helmut Marko admitted the youngster was in the wrong.

"This time he (Vettel) was rightly annoyed, yes," Marko, referring not only to Sochi but another incident between Kvyat and Vettel in China two weeks ago, told motorsport-magazin.com.

Asked what Vettel had told Red Bull officials after the Sochi incident, Marko revealed: "That we need to have a serious word with Kvyat, and he's right."

"But this time I really can find nothing that would pass as an excuse for the Russian," he added.

Even Red Bull team boss Christian Horner admitted it had been Kvyat's fault.

"He was perhaps a little overexcited because it was his home race," he told Bild newspaper. "But he's a young driver and he will learn from it."

F1 legend and Mercedes team chairman Niki Lauda was even more critical, telling the German broadcaster Sky that "If I was Vettel I'd kill him.

"The FIA should think about giving him a warning," the famous Austrian added.

personally I think like Lauda. If it was me I would have pulled a shumi spa 98, though I would make sure to actually get my hands on Kvyat.

[GrayGreat]

Fact 1: Turn 1 (OK, Turn 2, really): Vettel stabbed his brakes. Why? Because he tried to dive underneath Massa . At race start, turn-one lock-ups and bumps are both regular and expected. Nothing new here.

That's how it works at the start: a quick run for the first corner, and brake late, hard, and win position. If there are bumps on track, Kvyat would have known and should've accounted for that. Rookie mistake. He admits so himself, no reason to make up excuses for him.

No one is saying he is not at fault, neither anyone is holding Vettel guilty. The thing is, people just want Kivyat to disappear from Formula 1, and promote Verstappen instead of him, who has done the same thing in the past. Yes, mistake from Kivyat, but not without reason. People need to understand that.

[A-Bap]

Fact 1: Turn 1 (OK, Turn 2, really): Vettel stabbed his brakes. Why? Because he tried to dive underneath Massa . At race start, turn-one lock-ups and bumps are both regular and expected. Nothing new here.

That's how it works at the start: a quick run for the first corner, and brake late, hard, and win position. If there are bumps on track, Kvyat would have known and should've accounted for that. Rookie mistake. He admits so himself, no reason to make up excuses for him.

My point wasn't to excuse Danill, but to point out some things to those people who are demanding a severe penalty.

1. Vettel braked suddenly, and got hit at Turn 2.
2. Hitting someone at race start is not a mistake limited to rookies and hot-heads. Veteran's make this mistake quite frequently. Its not extreme in the least.
3. Hits, touches and crashes are normal at race starts. (PS: I didn't mean "bumps" on the track surface--the entry to T2 at Sochi is smooth)
4. Given the above, let's not be calling for Dannill's scalp.

Finally: Drivers should know that when you take action to avoid a crash, you're also increasing the risk that you might crash yourself, or get hit. Especially in traffic. Thus we have the cliche: "That's racing."

With respect to your quotes: I suspect that Marko's/Christian's statements were driven by PR, and the emotions of the moment--outrage. The outrage was fueled by two things: 1. Hype, that it was "Danill and Seb...again!" 2. Prince Seb's reaction. These factors clouded their ability to asses and talk about what had actually happened.

[ME4ME]

Your certainly entitled to your opinion. I have no idea why you put blame on Vettel at all though. You're basically saying he brake-checked Kvyat, is a spoiled brat and behaves like a prince. I think it's unfounded and total rubbish.

I don't see anything wrong with Horners or Marko's statement either. They'll have a talk with him, thats it. Marko even has the piece of mind to wait and let it rest, before having the talk, according to motorsport.com

[A-Bap]

Your certainly entitled to your opinion. I have no idea why you put blame on Vettel at all though. You're basically saying he brake-checked Kvyat, is a spoiled brat and behaves like a prince. I think it's unfounded and total rubbish.

I don't see anything wrong with Horners or Marko's statement either. They'll have a talk with him, thats it. Marko even has the piece of mind to wait and let it rest, before having the talk, according to motorsport.com

Fair.

RE: Seb: He used to be much more of a boy prince (read Webber's bio for details), but recently I had come to believe that this was behind him, so I've come to like him a great deal. However, this incident with Danill suggests to me he's not totally past it.

I am just disappointed at Seb's reaction...he should know better. I am also disappointed at Christian's reaction, too. I hate seeing anyone railroaded by a mob mentality.

[NL_Fer]

Kvyat should have seen, that Seb was on the inside of the turn and needed to brake hard, to prevent crashing others, who drove on the outside. And who knows, maybe the Redbull just has more grip at then race start than a Ferrari.

[ferkan]

Lol Vettel didnt break check Kvyat. Kvyat literally glued his foot to gas pedal and went for it. Even Ric was perplexed. Where did he think he would tuck in? Complete track was taken by Vet, Ric and Perez.

Kvyat went kamikaza to try and overtake as many cars as he can because his only chance to beating his team mate is to get ahead in T1 and T2.

[dans79]

My point wasn't to excuse Danill, but to point out some things to those people who are demanding a severe penalty.

well his driving history leaves a Lot to be desired.

Monaco 2014
reprimand for impeding Maldonado

Germany 2014
https://vimeo.com/103210762

Austria 2015
hit Perez at the start and damaged his wing.

There were some drivers braking on the straight after the start. Maybe they forgot which pedal to use, and I had nowhere to go.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/119627

japan 2015
https://www.formula1.com/content/fom-we ... take-.html

Austin 2015
http://www.f1zone.net/news/kvyat-disapp ... ash/49543/

China 2016
overly agressive

Russia 2016
Hit Vettel twice


incidents involving kvyat's are becoming more frequent and more serious. Considering he's in his 3rd season, the opposite should be happening.

Right now he some where around Maldonado & Grosjean 2012.

[A-Bap]

My point wasn't to excuse Danill, but to point out some things to those people who are demanding a severe penalty.

well his driving history leaves a Lot to be desired.

Monaco 2014
reprimand for impeding Maldonado

Germany 2014
https://vimeo.com/103210762

Austria 2015
hit Perez at the start and damaged his wing.

There were some drivers braking on the straight after the start. Maybe they forgot which pedal to use, and I had nowhere to go.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/119627

japan 2015
https://www.formula1.com/content/fom-we ... take-.html

Austin 2015
http://www.f1zone.net/news/kvyat-disapp ... ash/49543/

China 2016
overly agressive

Russia 2016
Hit Vettel twice


incidents involving kvyat's are becoming more frequent and more serious. Considering he's in his 3rd season, the opposite should be happening.

Right now he some where around Maldonado & Grosjean 2012.

He's no angel, but neither were a lot of drivers who later became greats. Let's not come at him with torches and pitchforks. It's not like we haven't seen "crowd favorite"-type drivers make such errors in the past.

[LionKing]

Watch this fan video and tell me where this swerve is or where this hard braking is? I believe Vettel did not brake at all. If he had touched his formula one brakes, it would have been obvious from the relative motion wrt. to Hamilton's car. He lifted a bit due to Perez car in front.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2016/05/01/f ... ing-crash/

As for Turn 2, Vettel and the others around braked as normal. If you look at the images of the crash, Kvyat is the only one with tyre smoke.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcI5YQezmq0

[Juzh]

Don't feed the troll.

[A-Bap]

Watch this fan video and tell me where this swerve is or where this hard braking is? I believe Vettel did not brake at all. If he had touched his formula one brakes, it would have been obvious from the relative motion wrt. to Hamilton's car. He lifted a bit due to Perez car in front.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2016/05/01/f ... ing-crash/

As for Turn 2, Vettel and the others around braked as normal. If you look at the images of the crash, Kvyat is the only one with tyre smoke.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcI5YQezmq0

Lion: Found this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qocyBsd7lTc

Its the first video I've seen that shows both on-boards side-by-side, and helps us better understand the timing of it all.

In this view, its clear the swerve I saw was due to Danill's impact. I stand 100% corrected on this question. However, it's still not clear when or if Seb, braked, but at speed on a flat section of a race course, lifting in an F1 car has the same effect as hard braking in other race cars. Seb did slow suddenly and dramatically, and Danill (reasonably) didn't expect it. He could not see Perez's problem.

[flickerf1]

Watch this fan video and tell me where this swerve is or where this hard braking is? I believe Vettel did not brake at all. If he had touched his formula one brakes, it would have been obvious from the relative motion wrt. to Hamilton's car. He lifted a bit due to Perez car in front.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2016/05/01/f ... ing-crash/

As for Turn 2, Vettel and the others around braked as normal. If you look at the images of the crash, Kvyat is the only one with tyre smoke.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcI5YQezmq0

Lion: Found this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qocyBsd7lTc

Its the first video I've seen that shows both on-boards side-by-side, and helps us better understand the timing of it all.

In this view, its clear the swerve I saw was due to Danill's impact. I stand 100% corrected on this question. However, it's still not clear when or if Seb, braked, but at speed on a flat section of a race course, lifting in an F1 car has the same effect as hard braking in other race cars. Seb did slow suddenly and dramatically, and Danill (reasonably) didn't expect it. He could not see Perez's problem.

Plus, Daniil had FW damage that would've made his car understeer had he tried to avoid Seb's car by turning to the left. Inevitably, he would've probably hit the Ferrari.