Anyone Else Sick Of The Fuel Saving Section In Races???

[mep]

häääääää?
I don't know what you want to see but I guess I will not like it.
People always blame the cars and the tires but you must notice that the more things are equal the less action you will see. When everybody has the same car, same tires, same fuel load and all drivers have almost the same skill you will never see any overtaking. How it should be even possible? They will all do the same lap times. The better ones will start on front the rest will follow. Unless anybody makes an mistake overtaking is impossible.
And what happens when one car is superior?
It will just lead the race by a couple of laps but you still don't see overtaking.
Forget about that overtaking it only happens when one car is much slower and where is the sense in it then?
Strategies are the things we need. Going on different strategy and then making the best out of it when you have a free track to get in front of your enemy is how you dice it out.

stops are boring and deserve no discussion here

Pit stop strategies are something for the smart minds among us.
When you try to analyze them and work out the best options you will notice that they are far from being boring.

[WhiteBlue]

F1 cars on hard tyres and with significantly lower downforce can overtake and I'm sure we will get to see such improvements eventually.

Whatever the technical circumstances are the teams figure out quickly what the right stop tactic is and all the artificial drama is quickly over because they all cover each other in the same strategy.

[mep]

F1 cars on hard tyres and with significantly lower downforce can overtake and I'm sure we will get to see such improvements eventually.

Why should they?
It's like I said above. They might be able to run close but overtaking?
Not as long as the leader is not significantly slowe or makes big mistake.

Whatever the technical circumstances are the teams figure out quickly what the right stop tactic is and all the artificial drama is quickly over because they all cover each other in the same strategy.

Sounds like you haven't been watching many refueling F1 races during the last years.

[WhiteBlue]

I have seen too many.

[PlatinumZealot]

What you describes has nothing to do with racing. The driver practically is an object most of the time. This is artificial drama which is only introduced to mask the fact that the cars and tyres are unfit for proper racing. I'm pretty sure this is not what the majority of fans want to see. They want to see Hamilton, Vettel, Webber, Alonso, Massa, Button, Kubica, Sutil, Kobayashi and the rest dice it out on track. I do not remember that one race thread on this board has been about a pit stop this year. It was all about Schumacher and Alonso in Monaco, Webber and Vettel in Turkey, Alonso, Kubica, Schumacher, Vettel, Massa and Sutil in Canada, more on track action in Silverstone and Hockenheim. Unless a team manipulates a stop to bring one driver ahead of another stops are boring and deserve no discussion here.

HOOOOOLLD ON!

Dice? You mean saving saving tyres and fuel? That's not dicing? The only dicing we saw this year was down to Rain and a very harsh track called Gilles Villenueve. Everything else was Boring with the odd soap opera drama to artificially spice things up. Bring back the full bore racing!

[marcush.]

some teams are good with tactics others less ,but i agree that teams have less influence when pit stops are not mandatory.this may be good .
as for the fuel saving crap ,it is beyond me why one should do that .I´d rather go balls out and hopwe for the best but at least can try to instead of holding back to make it to the finish with the same elapsed time ...thinking again ..i would of course nurse the car and polititely ask my driver to shortshift for the next 20 laps..

[xpensive]

But...is it only the forum's universal oracle that supports this fuel saving idea then?

[ringo]

All we want is: Low fuel quali and refueling.
We have not seen a final lap battle in ages.

Refueling can give us that.

[mep]

Fuel saving is a rational conclusion of your no refueling rule.
Adding to much fuel is just a to big penalty because you have to carry it around all race long. With refueling allowed this problem is not so prominent.
So guys choose now what do you want?
Full bore racing with refueling or Formula economic?

[marcush.]

All we want is: Low fuel quali and refueling.
We have not seen a final lap battle in ages.

Refueling can give us that.

err... Kobayashi vs Alonso /Buemi in Valencia
Schumacher vs Alonso Monaco
Schumacher vs sutil Canada ?

we had some we had some ,more than in the years before..

[WhiteBlue]

To me it feels like a year with more on track passing than ever before. And we still have a five way championship fight which is practically unheard of. If they fix the downforce and the tyres it can only get better. Some guys will never be satisfied. As soon as they do refueling you have the bloody race fuel qualifying again. Quali this year is the best we have had for many years. I absolutely love the Saturdays now. Even FP3 is usually good to watch because they do all the training for low fuel qualifying.

[Just_a_fan]

To me it feels like a year with more on track passing than ever before. And we still have a five way championship fight which is practically unheard of. If they fix the downforce and the tyres it can only get better. Some guys will never be satisfied.

So you feel that the season has been a good one so far but you want further changes to to the rules (on your pet issues naturally )

At least you're right at the end there where you mention some people never being happy

I would suggest that what we need now is a period of rule stability to ensure that we have several teams in the hunt for both titles. That is the best way to avoid the boring seasons of the early 2000s where one team dominated for far too long.

[marcush.]

I have to admit to being surprised after that subdued opening race things have evolved
to entertaining racing..
I feel the teams still tend to be to conservative or uninspired with their strategies.
(for Virgin HRT and Lotus there is no single reason for a qualy run or a aggressive soft tire strategy.They would do a lot better to use any situation to test their car and get a better understanding instead of going for a ultimate laptime ...thats feeding egos but complete nonsense.In a uncertain situation I ´m fo a gamble,but as long as you are 2or 3 seconds away from Q2 it is a waste of recources.

[strad]

Trying to conserve fuel AND race is counter intuitive..Oil and water mates...There is NO sense in trying to make race cars fuel efficent,,What? You think trimming a bit from racing will stretch world fuel? What? 30 seconds worth?
Someday we will have electric road cars and electric race cars but for now we use gasoline and at that gasoline that has never seen mother earth and is created in a lab.

[ringo]

All we want is: Low fuel quali and refueling.
We have not seen a final lap battle in ages.

Refueling can give us that.

err... Kobayashi vs Alonso /Buemi in Valencia

Alonso wasn't even focusing on Kobayashi. That wasn't really a battle per say. Just one guy with a vast advantage.

Schumacher vs Alonso Monaco

you mean when shumacher jumped the guy, and he though no passing was allowed?

Schumacher vs sutil Canada ?

ok, this one wasn't bad, but it's not for the lead.

we had some we had some ,more than in the years before..

These little battles are not what i would call epic battles. In all cases, except sutil, one driver was neither focusing on the attacker, or the attacker had a very big advantage.
Back in the 2000s, we had guys on the same tyres, batling the clock,sector after sector, going full bore. Then eventually they meet and the fight is on, all cars on the same type of tyre, but one maybe with a little more life.
All engines maxed out, 5 laps left in the race to fight, no traffic or distractions just a straight mano y mano fight; the fastest and bravest won.
Fight may end up with one guy being too brave, sliding off track, or the engine giving up the ghost or the tyres blowing out.

The closest thing i saw to it this year was hamilton in turkey running down the bulls, in china running down button (fight was called off) or in spain where the tyre blew out.
We can't get that drama if the teams are "nursing" like baby mamas.