Wide tire problem!!!!

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pompelmo
pompelmo
0
Joined: 22 Feb 2004, 16:51
Location: Lucija, Slovenia

Wide tire problem!!!!

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Ok, when a car goes into a turn tires are takikng some beating...
this is one of them...

The tire spins at one rate in a turn...but the outer side of the tire takes a longer path than the inner side of the tire..but the outer and the inner side are spinning at the same "frequency"..so th tire in a turn in non-stop skiding except a "microscopic" line somwhere in the midle...
..
Image

manchild
manchild
12
Joined: 03 Jun 2005, 10:54

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That is what gives it the grip... wear is good as long as there is enough of tyre to be worn by the end of the race.

pompelmo
pompelmo
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Joined: 22 Feb 2004, 16:51
Location: Lucija, Slovenia

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are you sure??
in physics the grip while NOT skiding is greater than grip while skiding...
(that's why you have TC and ABS--preventing tires to skid)

manchild
manchild
12
Joined: 03 Jun 2005, 10:54

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I'm not talking about skiding, I'm talking about tyre wear under friction.

pompelmo
pompelmo
0
Joined: 22 Feb 2004, 16:51
Location: Lucija, Slovenia

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I' sorry..my english is apparently not that good..
can you define me the diference between friction and skid??

manchild
manchild
12
Joined: 03 Jun 2005, 10:54

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Well, English isn't my first language too but I think that skid = sliding with some friction and when I said friction I meant friction without sliding - only tyre wear because outer side of the wheel has to cross more distance than inner side of the wheel.

pompelmo
pompelmo
0
Joined: 22 Feb 2004, 16:51
Location: Lucija, Slovenia

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yea but..tire has also grip in straits...this effect is escluded

manchild
manchild
12
Joined: 03 Jun 2005, 10:54

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pompelmo wrote:yea but..tire has also grip in straits...this effect is escluded
If there was no friction on the straights wheel would spin without moving the car...so, friction exists all the time just with diffrent characteristics and on the straights friction is only lesser that in truns. Same goes for tyre wear.

kilcoo316
kilcoo316
21
Joined: 09 Mar 2005, 16:45
Location: Kilcoo, Ireland

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I see what your trying to say.

But I think that would be a small wear issue compared to the energy being put through the tyre by the car.

Mr T
Mr T
0

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Grip comes from the deformation of the contact patch not this skiding you speak of! Slip - a term used to describe the wheels true heading to which it is actually pointing not mean the tyre is skiding along the surface, but this slip angle is due to the deformation of the contact patch. You must remember tyres 1) are normally never at 0 degrees camber, and 2) they have a slight curvature...... this means the inside and outside edges are not loaded the same, therefore wear is very small on the outter edge.

We are also only talking of a very small difference in radi between the inside and outside of a tire and the centre of the turn (as a percentage) there fore the difference you have indicated is very small. Having said that it is still there.....

MrT

Apex
Apex
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Joined: 08 Jul 2005, 00:54

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Havent you people heard of a differential?

Guest
Guest
0

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That sorts the difference between the inside and outside wheels - NOT the inside and outside edges of a single wheel which is looked at in isolation.

Mr T

pompelmo
pompelmo
0
Joined: 22 Feb 2004, 16:51
Location: Lucija, Slovenia

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Apex wrote:Havent you people heard of a differential?
I'm talking about single tire?? the outer edge vs. the inner edge

DaveKillens
DaveKillens
34
Joined: 20 Jan 2005, 04:02

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Obviously, if someone actually constructed and tried a tire two meters wide, there would be issues, and the tire almost impossible to turn. So there has to be a practical limit on tire width before this situation becomes an issue in turning performance and tire wear. But modern F1 tires are limited in width by the regulations. As well, they run grooves, and this would isolate the inner from the outer surface of the tread. But the outer part of the tire would travel further than the inner, and some deformation would have to be present.
At present, I would have to believe that this would not be a major concern to the tire engineers, considering that in a cornering scenario, sideslip, lateral forces, and the road surface, to name a few issues, would have a much larger impact in the tire.

User avatar
mep
29
Joined: 11 Oct 2003, 15:48
Location: Germany

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The tire can have a biger diameter at the outside edge than on the inside.
So the outside makes more way than the inside.
If you trife throu a corner the difference is balanced.