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Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
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m3_lover
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Joined: 26 Jan 2006, 07:29
Location: St.Catharines, Ontario, Canada

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1) How come F1 cars do not have four wheel steering, like all four tires turning, I know WRC has it, just wondering why doesn't F1 have it, it reduces the turning radius? Would it be a wieght issue?

2) I know the tire manufacturers have to conform a tire to width dimensions, before and after a race, couldn't they make a tire stretch horizontal pass the points, but when the tire is cold, it expands back to the original dimensions, or is that what happens when you get heat into the tires, it expands and puts more contact patch area on the track?

3) Do they have to have the antennas all in front of the driver, couldn't they stick all those antenna's somwhere inside the car or cockpit, or will that interfere with the signal?
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Figlio_del_Diavolo
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Joined: 20 Mar 2006, 22:07
Location: NY, USA

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1) It is forbidden by the FIA F1 Technical Regs: Article 10.4.1 - Any steering system which permits the re-alignment of more than two wheels is not permitted. Benetton ran a mild 4WS system in 1993 before active systems were banned.

2) The tire sidewall has a good amount of flex under lateral loading. That combined with the correct camber setup will optimize the tire contact patch.

3) One is usually a pitot tube for testing air speed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitot_tube). Cockpits are usually quite cramped as it is. It is probably the most practical area from a packaging standpoint. Not really much of an explanation though.
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Ciro Pabón
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Joined: 11 May 2005, 00:31

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I did not know that F-1 cars had Pitot tubes. But for them to work properly, the tube has to be separated from the static layer and in a place free of vortexes created by the car. This could be the reason.
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rsfocus
rsfocus
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Joined: 21 Feb 2006, 03:22
Location: australia

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do wrcars have 4ws? i cant think of any running that, if anything i think it is banned also? please correct me if i am wrong though...
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m3_lover
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Joined: 26 Jan 2006, 07:29
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I think if you look at the 2001 WRC compliation video from speed tv you see the Subaru back tires turning, type in WRC in google video to find the video
Simon: Nils? You can close in now. Nils?
John McClane: [on the guard's phone] Attention! Attention! Nils is dead! I repeat, Nils is dead, ----head. So's his pal, and those four guys from the East German All-Stars, your boys at the bank? They're gonna be a little late.
Simon: [on the phone] John... in the back of the truck you're driving, there's $13 billon dollars worth in gold bullion. I wonder would a deal be out of the question?
John McClane: [on the phone] Yeah, I got a deal for you. Come out from that rock you're hiding under, and I'll drive this truck up your ass.
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rsfocus
rsfocus
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Joined: 21 Feb 2006, 03:22
Location: australia

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m3_lover wrote:I think if you look at the 2001 WRC compliation video from speed tv you see the Subaru back tires turning, type in WRC in google video to find the video
i have it at home :D

maybe then they dont anymore? i guess they are now back to mechanical diffs and the like too...
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West
West
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Joined: 07 Jan 2004, 00:42
Location: San Diego, CA

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Michelin in 2003 was accused of making a tire that would expand beyond regulations as it heated up, but at pre-race tech inspection and post-race inspection, they would look normal.
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Jason
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Joined: 17 Mar 2006, 09:12
Location: KL, Malaysia

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rsfocus wrote:
m3_lover wrote:I think if you look at the 2001 WRC compliation video from speed tv you see the Subaru back tires turning, type in WRC in google video to find the video
i have it at home :D

maybe then they dont anymore? i guess they are now back to mechanical diffs and the like too...
Sigh, how is a WRC car going to run on mud if is not 4WD. You might not see it clearly but it's turning, it turns a bit only if the tires in the back turn like the front the car would be out of Ctrl.
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Scuderia_Russ
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Joined: 17 Jan 2004, 22:24
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My fragile, alcohol attacked grey matter seems to recall Benetton testing it during '94.......IIRC!
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joseff
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Joined: 24 Sep 2002, 11:53

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Sigh, how is a WRC car going to run on mud if is not 4WD. You might not see it clearly but it's turning, it turns a bit only if the tires in the back turn like the front the car would be out of Ctrl.
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Tom
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Joined: 13 Jan 2006, 00:24
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I think that the Benneton 4WS gave such little time advantage that it was discarded anyway.

Without a good advantage its just one more part to go wrong
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Spencifer_Murphy
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Joined: 11 Apr 2004, 23:29
Location: London, England, UK

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West Said:
Michelin in 2003 was accused of making a tire that would expand beyond regulations as it heated up, but at pre-race tech inspection and post-race inspection, they would look normal.
Kind of...what they were accused of was making tyre which although legal in pre-race conditions would get larger as it wore.

This was becuse the tyres had a much more square shape, meaning the contact patch was right on the legal limit. Even though they wree more square than the bridgestones they still had a curve on their shoulders and as this wore down the contact path thus became larger than the legal limit.

This is what they were accused of anyway. Guess who launched the protest??? Ferrari...at Monza, late in the season. Michelin were asked to re-design their tyres, and many believe this put their teams at a dlight disadvantage as they came into the season show down. Another Conspiracy theory for Manchild!!! :lol:
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taleed
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Joined: 19 Mar 2006, 18:46
Location: Oman/Muscat

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i feel like an idiot compared to you people...
...you know so much. I guess i have alot to
catch up on. Don't worry, i'll be on the same
page soon.


o(+_+)o
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Spencifer_Murphy
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Joined: 11 Apr 2004, 23:29
Location: London, England, UK

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Dont worry mate. I know very little compare to most of these guys. Some of the guys here are seriously smart (Scarbs, Davekillens, Manchild, Monstro to name but a few) I can barely keep up sometimes.

I've always been know at college / university / school as the one guy who knows everything about F1....then I come here and this is proven wrong lol.

Truth is though, we all learn things from eachother all the time. There's sooo much F1 stuff I dont know yet...

...after all I'm only 18 :oops:
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RacingManiac
RacingManiac
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Joined: 22 Nov 2004, 02:29

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The rule that says re-alignment of more than 2 wheels, does that mean also anysort of intentional bumpsteer is also banned? Be it as kinematic based(roll steer, probably useless as F1 car don't roll any meaningful amount) or complience based(Weissach Axle, like the 944)?
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