2019 [R09] Austrian Grand Prix, Spielberg, 28-30 June

[NathanOlder]

I don’t understand what argument you try to make that he isn’t entitled to the racing line ?

It´s easy, the racing line cannot be used always, only if there´s no car at it yet

There was no other car on the racing line he took and was committed to. There was another car trying to get on that racing line.

"the racing line he took"



so now where ever max goes, its now the racing line

[sosic2121]

I'm willing to guess that if the incident had been Charles overtaking Max on the inside, and running his line in the same way, there wouldn't be this clamour.

It's amusing to see some of the "this isn't racing" comments and we also see people generally bemoaning the lack of racing in F1.

There was racing on the previous lap and up to corner 3 on lap 69. Had Max not run Charles off the road we would have continued to see racing for the rest of the lap and further. So people who want racing are rightly dischuffed every time the racing is curtailed by the bargers.

This!!

+1

[Andres125sx]

I don’t understand what argument you try to make that he isn’t entitled to the racing line ?

It´s easy, the racing line cannot be used always, only if there´s no car at it yet

There was no other car on the racing line he took and was committed to. There was another car trying to get on that racing line.

Racing line is different if there's one car or if there are two in parallel mate, Max put his car parallel, and then take the racing line for one car as if Lecrerc will evaporate magically.

Same as Lecrerc respect Max line NOT going to the inner kerb at the apex, Max should have done the same at the outer kerb. But he didn't. And he could, it's exactly what he did on previous lap at that same corner, so not asking for anything weird, only for what he had already done just one lap ago.

But it's easier to pass if you push your rival out of track obviously, so he took the quick and easy way

[henry]

...people who want racing are rightly dischuffed every time the racing is curtailed by the bargers.

It's how they do things in Holland.

https://i.imgur.com/HwmYJai.gif

That’s what you should expect if you’re on the outside line.

[henry]

"take the inside line and dictate the corner".

He wasn’t doing a very good job of dictating the corner was he? Charles was 100% alongside him. We know this because the contact was front wheel to front wheel.

[DutchDopey]

It´s easy, the racing line cannot be used always, only if there´s no car at it yet

There was no other car on the racing line he took and was committed to. There was another car trying to get on that racing line.

Racing line is different if there's one car or if there are two in parallel mate, Max put his car parallel, and then take the racing line for one car as if Lecrerc will evaporate magically.

Same as Lecrerc respect Max line NOT going to the inner kerb at the apex, Max should have done the same at the outer kerb. But he didn't. And he could, it's exactly what he did on previous lap at that same corner, so not asking for anything weird, only for what he had already done just one lap ago.

But it's easier to pass if you push your rival out of track obviously, so he took the quick and easy way

A racing line is not different because someone is driving parallel, it has absolutely nothing to do with that. Come on, this is basic stuff.

[Wynters]

There was no other car on the racing line he took and was committed to. There was another car trying to get on that racing line.

Racing line is different if there's one car or if there are two in parallel mate, Max put his car parallel, and then take the racing line for one car as if Lecrerc will evaporate magically.

Same as Lecrerc respect Max line NOT going to the inner kerb at the apex, Max should have done the same at the outer kerb. But he didn't. And he could, it's exactly what he did on previous lap at that same corner, so not asking for anything weird, only for what he had already done just one lap ago.

But it's easier to pass if you push your rival out of track obviously, so he took the quick and easy way

A racing line is not different because someone is driving parallel, it has absolutely nothing to do with that. Come on, this is basic stuff.

'Racing line' is one of those excellent phrases that has a specific definition but often simply means whatever the individual needs it to mean.

Driver A opens the steering and bumps driver B off the track? Well, Driver A was taking the 'racing line' and it was up to Driver B to get out of the way.
Driver B tightens the steering to kiss the apex and bumps driver A off the track? Well, Driver B was taking the 'racing line' and it was up to Driver A to get out of the way.

Let's make it more interesting. Three cars enter a corner, line abreast. Driver C, on the outside, sweeps in to kiss the apex in order to take the corner on the 'racing line', hits driver B (who is in the middle) and bounces him into Driver A (who is on the inside). Wheels interlock and cars go flying. Racing incident? Driver C was on the 'racing line' so it wasn't his fault, right?

We can have racing (prolonged racing, even) without the need to push people off the track. However, if you gamble on hanging on around the outside then you gamble on being run out of road. That's been the way of things for a long time now.

[dans79]

Can the moderators please close this thread it's completely out of hand!

[sosic2121]

Can the moderators please close this thread it's completely out of hand!

You don't have to read, if you don't agree with some of us.
Closing threads solves nothing.

[dans79]

Can the moderators please close this thread it's completely out of hand!

Closing threads solves nothing.

Yes it does, it stops the back and forth baiting and antagonistic posts form continuing.

[Just_a_fan]

The thread is dead - the two sides won't change their minds now so what's the point of continued discussion? I suppose the one good reason to leave it open is that it stops the pollution of other threads with this argument. Those that absolutely must argue that black is white and vice versa can stay out of every other thread that way.

[izzy]

Only people who are losing want to have the thread closed

[hollus]

This is quickly getting personal, guys.
Making arguments is OK, repeating them for the 10th time is passable.
But this is, slowly, subtly, crossing the line into attacking other posters.
The purpose of an forum thread is not to defeat other posters; in my naive mind, it would be to learn new things and appreciate the subtleties of other points of view. Which of course starts with accepting that other people can have other points of view and, gosh, possibly be right. Or maybe there is no right an wrong, but a lot of implicitly and subjectively accepted rules which are themselves fuzzy (ie, what is the racing line and who is on it).

The thread can stay open for now, but personal attacks will not be looked at lightly.

Let's add to the discussion rather than repeat it louder and louder, shall we?

[Sieper]

Well this might be personal and as such not allowed but here is how I feel.

It are always the same people still 1,5 week after a race going out of their way to make a point about Verstappen. Never any positivity about anything said driver may have done during that race, none of that. Just always going out of their way to only speak about points they feel are bad. There are a few here that are in the "don't like him" camp that actually look at both sides of the medal (those are the posts that actually stand a chance to change somebody else's thinking imho, at least for me) but for the most part it is just a tiresome bash party that will achieve absolutely nothing (in the minds of the people that do feel he is actually a good driver). Some of these posters have been so consistent that they are on my ignore list. But still, I'd like to read their opinions/information on other threads.

It would be nice to have a ignore list specifically for the race topics.

[Andres125sx]

There was no other car on the racing line he took and was committed to. There was another car trying to get on that racing line.

Racing line is different if there's one car or if there are two in parallel mate, Max put his car parallel, and then take the racing line for one car as if Lecrerc will evaporate magically.

Same as Lecrerc respect Max line NOT going to the inner kerb at the apex, Max should have done the same at the outer kerb. But he didn't. And he could, it's exactly what he did on previous lap at that same corner, so not asking for anything weird, only for what he had already done just one lap ago.

But it's easier to pass if you push your rival out of track obviously, so he took the quick and easy way

A racing line is not different because someone is driving parallel, it has absolutely nothing to do with that. Come on, this is basic stuff.

So when some car get parallel to the car in front at a straight, but at the outside, the car in front can, before turning in, go to the outer kerb and push the car trying to pass out of track, because he´s only using the normal racing line, he didn´t do anything wrong, right?