2020 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, July 17-19

[Schuttelberg]

Alexander Albon is “being made to look like an idiot” at Red Bull, according to rival and close friend George Williams.

I must have missed that one who is he?

Redbull is a marketing operation so they invest and "arrange" everything to create a legendary persona who can market their products. They are not good for F1 as a sport... as a spectacle, maybe...


I am surprised Bottas was close to Ham frankly. I was expecting a bigger delta.

Overall Mercedes engined cars looked very strong. I think first 3 races were the weakest for Merc and it looks like they are going to win all three, if they don't collide to each other... I think Merc may win all races this year.

I think Bottas has proven himself to be very fast, especially over 1 lap. It's race craft where Lewis really differentiates himself from Valteri.

I don't get the RP hate, and I am saying this as a Mclaren fan. The other teams not pushing the rules in regard to copying a proven design is foolish. Eventually they come around (see: tunnels, high nose, mid engine vs front engine, reclined seating positions, etc).

This is where good team managers are worth their weight in gold. They basically are the captain steering the ship and set the direction.

Bottas was 0.1 down and if patterns are anything to go by, Bottas is generally 0.1-0.2 down on Saturday. Rosberg was always closer to Hamilton on Saturday.

My assessment of the whole thing? For what it counts, I think Hamilton, a lot like Alonso and Vettel focus a lot more on Sunday than Saturday. This doesn't mean they bin qualifying because it has a lot of importance but they tilt the favour of set up more for Sunday in order to allow them the chance to come back in the event things don't pan out perfectly or there are any first lap shenanigans. There is a reason Rosberg/Bottas go through or went through the tyres a lot more on Sunday and not to mention the wheel to wheel combat where Hamilton easily aces them both. My personal feeling is both tried to put Hamilton on the backfoot early and tried/try to make him pass on track because they both know that if the shoe is on the other foot they have a lesser chance of winning. It suits Hamilton as well because he is able to still ring a lap out on Saturday and in the event the opposition does get him which in Rosberg's case was one in two and a half and one in four with Bottas, he still can apply the pressure on Sunday.

Bottas was not winning a normal Austrian Grand Prix. Hamilton was catching him hand over fist and in all likelihood would have passed him. In the second race, he was put in his place and frankly, second is the worst position a Mercedes can finish this year which is what he achieved. His only opportunity tomorrow is at the start and even if he gets Hamilton, Hamilton might do him in at the stops or on track although this is a notoriously hard track to pass. Over a full season, Bottas will need a Rosberg'esque' ball of fortune to finish ahead in the standings.

[El Scorchio]

That’s me (waking up at 6am) for almost every race of the season


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You have my sympathy. It’s not easy.

Thanks, lol... It does suck, but there is no way I can enjoy a race after it has ended, even when I may stay away from the net/media to not spoil the result... Especially hard after too much bourbon the night before


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know exactly what you mean. If it’s recorded you just forward through it to the end, or otherwise it’s bloody hard not to discover the result. There’s nothing quite like watching live sport either!

[NathanOlder]

That’s me (waking up at 6am) for almost every race of the season


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You have my sympathy. It’s not easy.

Thanks, lol... It does suck, but there is no way I can enjoy a race after it has ended, even when I may stay away from the net/media to not spoil the result... Especially hard after too much bourbon the night before


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I love the 6am races, Means my kids are still sleeping, and after the race finishes, I have my whole day to do anything I want.

[NathanOlder]

All this talk of Hamilton's lap. I think he could have gone faster still. Wasn't he down on his previous S1 time?

Indeed. He was a tenth down on his previous S1 time and then pulled more from the lap as it progressed. He should have been a couple of tenths quicker than his eventual pole time.

I think his 1st sector was only 0.024 down. nowhere near a tenth.

[TechAddict]

He just doesn’t get it......

For me - what makes me excited in F1 - is a fightning wheel to wheel and 0.010 gap between. This is racing and this is adrenaline.

If for you guys it is amazing when one team is 1s quicker than anyone else... ok...

That is not F1. F1 has almost always had a dominant team. There was few years as exception. With regards to the last 4-5 years, other teams have to do a better job than cheating (Ferrari) or designing cars only good at single type of circuits (hand stand Redbull). If 2 year old Merc (RP) can beat the new Ferrari and Redbull that is not Merc's fault.

F1 is demonstration of bleeding edge of tech + strategy + great driving + some luck.

Great driving is part of F1, not the whole.

It is a "team" "motor" "sport".

F1 might always have had a dominant team, but it almost never ended by other teams doing better, so plesse stop with that statement. Williams in 90, new regs. Ferrari in 00, new regs, red bull 10, new regs. Mercedes would never have caught up with RB if the V8 were still arround, and Vettel would be 10 WDC. No one would have liked that. I will not take anything from Hamilton, he is awsome, I will rater have him breaking all the records than Vettel, but I even sense he would like to compete on a more level playing field.

FIA have tried a lot, but I do not even think budget caps or similar will change much, MB are so fare ahead that they can sleep one year and still win. I love the things they invent (in the interest of the sports innovative history) DAS, FRIC, burning oil. I even like Ferrari for trying so hard to be competitive, OK they did not stay on the right side of the rules, but that does not mean that the fuel flow trick was not inventive and impressive. But DAS could just as easily have been unlegal. Now it isn’t, but as long as we have the tires we have now and more importantly the PU system, no one but MB will be WCC. So 2022 is the best chance in many years. I just think they should look equally at regulating mechanical suspention parts as aero. I think many underestimate how goon MB are in that area. I drive KZ2 gokarts myself, and getting on the throttle early in corners or even on kerbs wins you a lot of laptime.

[NathanOlder]

All this talk of Hamilton's lap. I think he could have gone faster still. Wasn't he down on his previous S1 time? Had Bottas taken pole, this would have been highlighted by his critics no end. It's unbelievable how fickle F1 fans are.
People are all over Albon at the moment when the guy who is sat on pole cost him a win in the first race.

HAM didn't cost ALB anything in hindsight. ALB DNF'd due to a mechanical failure of some sort, and clearly ALB didn't give HAM the same room he then gave PER the next race, showing he probably realized he created his own misfortune by Schumi chopping HAM.

What an utterly pathetic post! Exactly the sort of post that brings down the quality of a forum.

Albon's DNF could have resulted from the collision as attributed to by Honda although I do acknowledge that they could be mind games. I have no bias of any form towards Albon and thank heavens the stewards had more sense than you. I can see the side of the argument that Hamilton's penalty was harsh although that's a whole new subject of discussion but to say Albon called for the collision or to say that hindsight proves that Albon's result wasn't affected shows your pathetic bias. May be then, you should feel that Vettel shouldn't have been penalised for Baku 2017 as Hamilton was anyway not going to win because of his headrest?

Pathetic!

No comparing it to Baku 17 would be like saying, Hamilton would have won if it wasn't for Vettel hitting him. (which of course is not true) As for the Albon talk, He may have won in Austria, he should have been patient, and should have been careful, he had such an advantage, why not wait for DRS. The team should have been telling him how much time he had, and that he could take his time, no need to rush.

[etusch]

I don't think vettel reads this forum. But if he does I strongly recomend him to put a car between Leclerc and him as soon as race starts.

[NathanOlder]

Only pattern I see is your anti Max posts on this forum.

Then you are a very poor observer. I ain't bashing Max. I wanted Max to put up a real challenge to Hamilton this year. It would have been great to watch. Unfortunately Redbull has decided to put all their eggs in one basket and it is just not working.

Max would have won the first race in Austria. He maximised the second race. His position against Hamilton has nothing to do with him, only the fact that nobody is near the Mercedes.

If anyone is looking at the last 2 races and this qualifying and saying any of the drivers aren't up to the mark compared to the Mercedes drivers they don't understand our sport. The championship positions are decided. 1 and 2 and the WCC. In equal cars or even a slightly slower car, Verstappen will eat Bottas alive. Hamilton is a whole different matter.

Just wondering what makes you say Max would have won the first race?

[Schuttelberg]

HAM didn't cost ALB anything in hindsight. ALB DNF'd due to a mechanical failure of some sort, and clearly ALB didn't give HAM the same room he then gave PER the next race, showing he probably realized he created his own misfortune by Schumi chopping HAM.

What an utterly pathetic post! Exactly the sort of post that brings down the quality of a forum.

Albon's DNF could have resulted from the collision as attributed to by Honda although I do acknowledge that they could be mind games. I have no bias of any form towards Albon and thank heavens the stewards had more sense than you. I can see the side of the argument that Hamilton's penalty was harsh although that's a whole new subject of discussion but to say Albon called for the collision or to say that hindsight proves that Albon's result wasn't affected shows your pathetic bias. May be then, you should feel that Vettel shouldn't have been penalised for Baku 2017 as Hamilton was anyway not going to win because of his headrest?

Pathetic!

No comparing it to Baku 17 would be like saying, Hamilton would have won if it wasn't for Vettel hitting him. (which of course is not true) As for the Albon talk, He may have won in Austria, he should have been patient, and should have been careful, he had such an advantage, why not wait for DRS. The team should have been telling him how much time he had, and that he could take his time, no need to rush.

Another doze of sheer pathetic. How result oriented are you people? Monza 2018, Lewis went for it against Seb around the outside resulting in Seb spinning and that could easily have been Lewis. He could have waited for DRS and then made a plunge? This is racing. Not monopoly deals. You see a gap, you go for it. I can bring up 5 different occasions when it's ended up in tears for Hamilton. Albon and RedBull acquire exactly 0% blame for that incident and it's a healthy dose of fanboyism that says anything opposite. I guess, every driver has those apart from Bottas.

[Schuttelberg]

I don't think vettel reads this forum. But if he does I strongly recomend him to put a car between Leclerc and him as soon as race starts.

I think for Ferrari, the most important thing is to have both cars finish and do the laps. My hunch is that if the weather is playing a part, Vettel will hold back but if not then that entire middle pack from P3 to P14 will be all over the shop. I just hope and pray Seb doesn't spin or cause an accident. A part of me thinks he's going to be extremely professional about his remaining days with Ferrari and a part of me feels he's going to race for himself and basically say 'crash or yield.' Specially with Charles. I think he has a score to settle with him and history suggests he can be very ruthless.

[SmallSoldier]

You have my sympathy. It’s not easy.

Thanks, lol... It does suck, but there is no way I can enjoy a race after it has ended, even when I may stay away from the net/media to not spoil the result... Especially hard after too much bourbon the night before


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I love the 6am races, Means my kids are still sleeping, and after the race finishes, I have my whole day to do anything I want.

That’s definitely a positive of which I try to take full advantage... But... I’m a late sleeper and most often than not, Friday’s and Saturday’s involve a few (sometimes too many) drinks with friends... That makes it a little more challenging... Wouldn’t mind if it would be at 9am instead


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[GPR-A]

HAM didn't cost ALB anything in hindsight. ALB DNF'd due to a mechanical failure of some sort, and clearly ALB didn't give HAM the same room he then gave PER the next race, showing he probably realized he created his own misfortune by Schumi chopping HAM.

What an utterly pathetic post! Exactly the sort of post that brings down the quality of a forum.

Albon's DNF could have resulted from the collision as attributed to by Honda although I do acknowledge that they could be mind games. I have no bias of any form towards Albon and thank heavens the stewards had more sense than you. I can see the side of the argument that Hamilton's penalty was harsh although that's a whole new subject of discussion but to say Albon called for the collision or to say that hindsight proves that Albon's result wasn't affected shows your pathetic bias. May be then, you should feel that Vettel shouldn't have been penalised for Baku 2017 as Hamilton was anyway not going to win because of his headrest?

Pathetic!

Very well said.
Some of the Lewis fans are simply blind who can't accept that he can have lapse in judgement.

[Hoffman900]

Redbull is a marketing operation so they invest and "arrange" everything to create a legendary persona who can market their products. They are not good for F1 as a sport... as a spectacle, maybe...


I am surprised Bottas was close to Ham frankly. I was expecting a bigger delta.

Overall Mercedes engined cars looked very strong. I think first 3 races were the weakest for Merc and it looks like they are going to win all three, if they don't collide to each other... I think Merc may win all races this year.

I think Bottas has proven himself to be very fast, especially over 1 lap. It's race craft where Lewis really differentiates himself from Valteri.

I don't get the RP hate, and I am saying this as a Mclaren fan. The other teams not pushing the rules in regard to copying a proven design is foolish. Eventually they come around (see: tunnels, high nose, mid engine vs front engine, reclined seating positions, etc).

This is where good team managers are worth their weight in gold. They basically are the captain steering the ship and set the direction.

There is copying and copying... All teams know that Mercedes handled the data to Racing Point, they just can not prove it.

Just think about this - Even Mercedes itself has issues to develop a thin nose. It took them a lot of effort and multiple crash testing to develop the tiniest nose. None of the other team was able to replicate it to the same level (because it is about the internal structures of the honeycomb aluminium and about the layers of different carbon fibre types and orientations) and now Racing Point just "look" at the pictures and boom did it one the first try... Even if they 3D scanned the whole Mercedes they needed a lot of "help" or "insider info" to "replicate" it...

Usually, when teams trying new stuff there is always some level of issues (overheating, vibrations, lack of stiffness, ...), but not in Racing Point, they "changed" the whole concept and did it on the firts try - must have the most experienced engineers in F1...

"All teams know.. but they cannot prove it". So it's just suspicion at this point. I'm not thrilled about it, but if one makes declarative statements, they need to back it up with evidence. So far, none has surfaced. Credit to Renault for leading the charge on that.


As for copying, then if they are found legal, then good on them. They exploited a loophole and got a competitive advantage. That's racing in a nutshell. The fall out would be teams requiring more parts to be designed in-house, but there is a balancing act as doing so raises the entry cost for new teams and puts teams like Williams and Haas on even more of a back foot.

Half the discussion on here is speculative. "This person could have won", "someone would have dnf'ed anyway", etc. The great part about racing is the results are what they are and anything is capable of happening up until the finish line. Speculation is just that. It's fun, it's a sport onto itself, but it doesn't change what was.

[Schuttelberg]

What is going on at Renault?

[zibby43]

He just doesn’t get it......

For me - what makes me excited in F1 - is a fightning wheel to wheel and 0.010 gap between. This is racing and this is adrenaline.

If for you guys it is amazing when one team is 1s quicker than anyone else... ok...

That is not F1. F1 has almost always had a dominant team. There was few years as exception. With regards to the last 4-5 years, other teams have to do a better job than cheating (Ferrari) or designing cars only good at single type of circuits (hand stand Redbull). If 2 year old Merc (RP) can beat the new Ferrari and Redbull that is not Merc's fault.

F1 is demonstration of bleeding edge of tech + strategy + great driving + some luck.

Great driving is part of F1, not the whole.

It is a "team" "motor" "sport".

Toto’s quote from a few years ago about the RB having “so much rake that it looks like it's doing a hand-stand as it comes down the straight” is one of the funniest interview quotes in F1 history.

It was after Toto snapped from hearing more moaning about Merc’s straight line speed from good ol’ Christian.

Thank you for reminding me of that.