RBR and Force India to swap engines?

[WhiteBlue]

Norbert Haug has said that Red Bull will not get Merc engines in 2011 due to a continuing McLaren veto. Merc themselves would like to see their engines in the Red Bulls.

[aral]

Norbert Haug has said that Red Bull will not get Merc engines in 2011 due to a continuing McLaren veto. Merc themselves would like to see their engines in the Red Bulls.

But it is being reported in the German press, that RBR WILL get merc engines next year. This is partly to stop their claims for engine equalisation, but mainly due to the fact that Force India are not coming up with the cash. FI are to get Renaults. Further, Dennis denied that McLaren were vetoing the supply of engines to RBR.

[ESPImperium]

Mercedes to Red Bull and Renault to Force India and Lotus???

The Lotus and Renault deal is almost a certanty now. As Renault have aggreed to give Lotus the gearbox and engine for 2011 onward, this will be a big step for Lotus. It will also mean that they wont have to worry about dodgy hydrolics, thay will have a proven package and a good, relyable and efficient engine.

As for Renault and Mercedes doing the engine shuffle with Red Bull and Force India, i doubt it, but can see it happen like this if it does happen. Mercedes pay off Force India $10M to get Vettel under their wing. And for Renault to take on Force India over Epsilon in my opinion, Force India would have to swap Petrov and Sutil arround as Renault have been sniffing arround Sutil in recent months. It would give Renault a boost in driver quality, it would give FI much needed sponsor money and it would stop Horners whining over engine parity.

And the Epsilon-HRT merger is a dead one, as both have their own 2011 programmes on the way.

[WhiteBlue]

Haug said the Red Bull deal would be something they want to do but they are vetoed by McLaren. So it will not happen before 2012.

[WhiteBlue]

Haug said publicly today that only the McLaren veto stops them and that the deal is not on for next year. Forget the other rumors. It is the official Mercedes position. They will not say in TV that the deal is off and do something else in secret. It is not their style.

[segedunum]

Forget the other rumors. It is the official Mercedes position.

Is it? Well, it seems to be 'Haug's' official position, and that isn't exactly stable. Mercedes themselves have kept rather quiet.

[wesley123]

I thought FI had a support deal with McLaren wich would also include the engines for 5 years?

Anyway, I dont think Merc engines in the Red Bull will happen, Newey chose the renault not for nothing and the Merc will just spoil his whole car.

[WhiteBlue]

Forget the other rumors. It is the official Mercedes position.

Is it? Well, it seems to be 'Haug's' official position, and that isn't exactly stable. Mercedes themselves have kept rather quiet.

Haug's position is Vice President, Mercedes-Benz for Motorsport. He reports to Dr. Dieter Zetsche the CEO of Mercedes Benz and Chairman of Daimler AG. At Petronas Mercedes GP the CEO Nick Fry and the team principal Ross Brawn report to Haug. At Mercedes High Performance Engines Ltd. the managing director Thomas Fuhr also reports to Haug. So if Haug makes a statement about Mercedes motor sport or F1 engines you can take it to the bank. It doesn't get any more official unless Zetsche himself tells you.

We would have worked with Red Bull already this year. However, we have an exclusive contract with McLaren. Understandably, McLaren has put in the veto. We have to respect contracts, of course. That is the situation. I would be very happy to see Mark Webber, who was formerly with us (Mercedes), and of course Sebastian Vettel, drive with our engines. But at the moment that is not the case.

I thought FI had a support deal with McLaren wich would also include the engines for 5 years?

Anyway, I dont think Merc engines in the Red Bull will happen, Newey chose the renault not for nothing and the Merc will just spoil his whole car.

If Force India defaults on payment - as they apparently do - the contract obviously is void. It is well known from reliable sources (Haug, Joe Saward, AMuS) that Newey and Horner want the Merc engines. The point is that Merc and McLaren have a partnership deal which expirers at the end of 2011. Until 2012 McLaren has the right to veto any recipients of Merc engines, and they do object to Red Bull as a customer according to Haug's statement.

[ChrisTipper]

The Red Bull car is designed around the Renault engine, so I dont see even though the mercedes engine is the best will help Red Bull much. FI has a contract for 5 yeasrs so I dont see that changing.

[raymondu999]

As I understood it, Newey has worked with Merc engines before when he was at MacMerc. But he didn't like it because he couldn't make an ass as tight as he could if he used the Renault.

[raceman]

All rumours.....!

No engine switch between RBR and FI

[aral]

The Red Bull car is designed around the Renault engine, so I dont see even though the mercedes engine is the best will help Red Bull much. FI has a contract for 5 yeasrs so I dont see that changing.

If the swap comes, I would have little concern about Neweys ability, to redesign the rear to cope. After all, the rear will have to be redesigned for next year, so as to accommodate KERS.

[xpensive]

I find this thread rather infantile, when I simply cannot belive that the Mercedes engines could be traded off just like that
at Force India's discretion? Moreover, there are strong links between McLaren and FI to prevent that from happening.

[aral]

I find this thread rather infantile, when I simply cannot belive that the Mercedes engines could be traded off just like that
at Force India's discretion? Moreover, there are strong links between McLaren and FI to prevent that from happening.

To call a thread that is discussing reports in the press, as "infantile" is in fact, infantile itself. Reports are not without foundation and deserve to be discussed. Already,today, Whitmarsh is denying a Merc assertion that McLaren are using a veto. So either Haug is telling a porky, or Whitmarsh is. Therefore any denial from Merc, must seriously be questioned.

[marcush.]

force india is using a lot more than the engine from Mercedes ..they have a partnership with MCL to supply transmission parts as well..that would be a huge blow for them ...as they need a new partner for that as well...