Haas VF16 Ferrari

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bhall II
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by bhall II » Fri Sep 02, 2016 1:17 am

I think it's a bit more reminiscent of the design Honda sometimes used on RA108...

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My guess is that it reduces drag while minimizing the negative impact a weaker rear wing can have on underbody efficiency.

Because the wing is aerodynamically coupled to the diffuser, whatever you do to one has an effect on the other. Moreover, all changes have upstream consequences, i.e. the diffuser and rear wing affect both the leading edge of the floor and the front wing.

Simply lowering the wing's AoA reduces downforce/drag across the board.

A Mercedes-style "spoon" wing featuring a lower AoA at each tip reduces drag by way of reduced downforce and minimized tip vortices, while the higher AoA of the wing's center section maintains a stronger connection to the diffuser's center section, an area where the crash structure probably makes the connection more challenging under any circumstances.

The Haas design seems like it will reduce drag across the board while maintaining a more consistent connection along the entire width of the diffuser. If so, it likely won't reduce drag as much as other solutions, but the rest of the car won't lose as much downforce.

PlatinumZealot
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by PlatinumZealot » Fri Sep 02, 2016 3:54 am

F1NAC wrote:curved rear wing
trying to reduce vortices strength at the edges?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CrQc8jBWIAAuAMa.jpg
I am ready to watch a boat load of problems from this thing... looks like something designed state-side. Very ambitious!
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sprint car76
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by sprint car76 » Fri Sep 02, 2016 6:05 am

Care to explain why something designed stateside would mean a boatload of problems?

dans79
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by dans79 » Fri Sep 02, 2016 9:19 am

sprint car76 wrote:Care to explain why something designed stateside would mean a boatload of problems?
Yes, please explain...... :evil:

wesley123
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by wesley123 » Fri Sep 02, 2016 11:13 am

I'd say a consideration in design of the wing would have been simplicity. In this way Haas didn't need to design new endplates and by maintaining the center shape the effect the exhaust has would remain largely the same.
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Aaronque
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by Aaronque » Fri Sep 02, 2016 12:14 pm

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turbof1
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by turbof1 » Fri Sep 02, 2016 1:09 pm

Although surprising from a new team like HAAS, designs like these were bound to happen with the current stable and restricted ruleset. In a nutshell designers are getting bored and are looking for ambitious and extreme wings which are very complicated to work out with DRS. Mercedes started this trend back in 2014.

It might work depending on much they get to use DRS.
#AeroFrodo

PlatinumZealot
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by PlatinumZealot » Sun Sep 04, 2016 2:30 am

dans79 wrote:
sprint car76 wrote:Care to explain why something designed stateside would mean a boatload of problems?
Yes, please explain...... :evil:
Just playing with the made in USA part. But seriously though, "W-wing had problems on the DRS re-attachment in past implementations. They prove very fickle with flow reattachment.
"The true champions are also great men. They are capable of making difficult decisions, of admitting their mistakes and of pushing harder than before when they get up from a fall."

- Ferrari chairman Sergio Marchionne

F1T
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Haas revives double-waved rear wing at Monza

Post by F1T » Sun Sep 04, 2016 9:46 pm

Haas revives double-waved rear wing at Monza - Development blog

The Haas F1 Team drew a lot of attention with its new double-waved, M-like rear wing, a completely unique shape for a modern rear wing in Formula One. It's rare these days to see a rear wing that has a different shape along its entire span, and hardly a surprise that Mercedes have, or at least had the most varying profile with its spoon rear wing, as the ones used at Monza and Spa-Francorchamps. Apart from the need to test it under yaw, such designs are furthermore made difficult by DRS, as the DRS trigger and flap usually needs appropriate redesign as well.

Still, Haas pulled it off, with an M-shaped profile of the main plane and the leading edge of the moveable flap. The team did not use the wing at Spa, but it could possibly been seen again at other venues this year, as it still offered more downforce than some other wings seen at Monza.

In the top speed charts, both Haas cars were, in qualifying, around 5km/h down at the speed trap at Variante della Roggia on the factory Ferrari cars, who raced the same, upgraded Ferrari engines. That's pretty much at the bottom of the ranking. The team's drivers however were happy with their car's balance - thanks also to a modified front wing -, and eventually only missed out on points due to other factors than pure pace.

While the rear wing does look refreshing, and very different to what other teams are using, the idea is still not entirely new. Renault for instance - with James Allison as its Technical Director - fitted an M-profile rear wing to its {Renault R30} as well. While clearly more simple in shape and without a moveable upper flap, the team ran this rear wing in the early races on 2010. Once they finished their own version of McLaren's F-duct - a much more efficient way of cutting drag - the team reverted to a conventional horizontal profile.

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f1316
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by f1316 » Mon Sep 12, 2016 8:39 am

f1316 wrote:
F1NAC wrote:curved rear wing
trying to reduce vortices strength at the edges?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CrQc8jBWIAAuAMa.jpg
Seems like quite a big wing for Monza.

Interesting one; not sure I've ever seen one exactly like that before. Maybe this is the closest:

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/wp-c ... t-R30a.jpg
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/tech- ... gs-825426/

They used the same comparison as me :)

GM7
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by GM7 » Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:18 pm

New front wing :

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Morteza
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by Morteza » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:46 pm

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sprint car76
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Re: Haas VF16 Ferrari

Post by sprint car76 » Sat Oct 08, 2016 9:02 pm

Anybody got pictures of what they strengthened on the frt wing to make it work?