2021 São Paulo Grand Prix - Interlagos, Nov 12-14

[Starkblood80]

viewtopic.php?p=1008240#p1008240

With your anti Hamilton/Mercedes narrative and your seemingly deliberate attempts at winding other forum members up, You make that very difficult at times.

Getting wound up is a choice that individuals consciously make in their own full capacity. It's not against the forum rules for an individual to express an opinion about a driver or a team. But going on personal attack, is against the rules. There are civilized ways to handle arguments and disagreements.

I didn’t comment on the right or wrong of said posts, I merely stated that your posting habits make it difficult for other forum members not to personally attack you.
IMHO I think you know exactly what you’re doing and that you take some pleasure in it, but again that is just my opinion.

[djones]

I wonder why the stewards decisions always take so long? Even some very clear incidents during at race is often decided after the race. Is it just to make themselves seem more important or what? In case with Max's parc ferme infringement it should be an easy decision for them, but now that it takes so long one could suspect that they are making some sort of a package deal with the Merc rear wing and Max's fingers that results in what's best for the WDC battle.
I think that if the decisions were made in a more reasonable time frame we would have far less outcries of FIA/Merc marriage or FIArarri as it used to be back in the Schumi era.

Sorry for going OT, looking forward to the sprint (not really) and the race tomorrow!

It's a huge business with literally millions of dollars at stake. They probably know what they are going to do quite fast, but will then have legal people and all sorts covering details off.

[scheffers]

Hahaha comments on Max sabotaging or possibilities for sabotaging the wing with two fingers pinched together in 1 second are funny.

[djones]

Hahaha comments on Max sabotaging or possibilities for sabotaging the wing with two fingers pinched together in 1 second are funny.

You're TOTALLY missing the point.

[JordanMugen]

Hahaha comments on Max sabotaging or possibilities for sabotaging the wing with two fingers pinched together in 1 second are funny.

You're TOTALLY missing the point.

Mercedes are not permitted to use a rear wing that can be modified without the use of tools anyway, so Verstappen touching the car or not is a moot point:

34.6:

A competitor may not modify any part on the car or make changes to the set-up of the suspension whilst the car is being held under parc fermé conditions. In the case of a breach of this Article the relevant driver must start the race from the pit lane and follow the procedures laid out in Article 36.2.

In order that the scrutineers may be completely satisfied that no alterations have been made to the suspension systems or aerodynamic configuration of the car (with the exception of the front wing) whilst in pre-race parc fermé, it must be clear from physical inspection that changes cannot be made without the use of tools.

[dans79]

Mercedes are not permitted to use a rear wing that can be modified without the use of tools anyway, so Verstappen touching the car or not is a moot point:

34.6:

A competitor may not modify any part on the car or make changes to the set-up of the suspension whilst the car is being held under parc fermé conditions. In the case of a breach of this Article the relevant driver must start the race from the pit lane and follow the procedures laid out in Article 36.2.

In order that the scrutineers may be completely satisfied that no alterations have been made to the suspension systems or aerodynamic configuration of the car (with the exception of the front wing) whilst in pre-race parc fermé, it must be clear from physical inspection that changes cannot be made without the use of tools.

That doesn't cover damage!

[djones]

Hahaha comments on Max sabotaging or possibilities for sabotaging the wing with two fingers pinched together in 1 second are funny.

You're TOTALLY missing the point.

Mercedes are not permitted to use a rear wing that can be modified without the use of tools anyway, so Verstappen touching the car or not is a moot point:

34.6:

A competitor may not modify any part on the car or make changes to the set-up of the suspension whilst the car is being held under parc fermé conditions. In the case of a breach of this Article the relevant driver must start the race from the pit lane and follow the procedures laid out in Article 36.2.

In order that the scrutineers may be completely satisfied that no alterations have been made to the suspension systems or aerodynamic configuration of the car (with the exception of the front wing) whilst in pre-race parc fermé, it must be clear from physical inspection that changes cannot be made without the use of tools.

Sorry, but there is a difference between modified and damaged.

Don't get me wrong, I'm 99.99% sure Max did not do anything to the wing other than touch it. But the key here is he DID touch it and there IS a chance it could have done something.

[basti313]

You're TOTALLY missing the point.

Mercedes are not permitted to use a rear wing that can be modified without the use of tools anyway, so Verstappen touching the car or not is a moot point:

34.6:

A competitor may not modify any part on the car or make changes to the set-up of the suspension whilst the car is being held under parc fermé conditions. In the case of a breach of this Article the relevant driver must start the race from the pit lane and follow the procedures laid out in Article 36.2.

In order that the scrutineers may be completely satisfied that no alterations have been made to the suspension systems or aerodynamic configuration of the car (with the exception of the front wing) whilst in pre-race parc fermé, it must be clear from physical inspection that changes cannot be made without the use of tools.

Sorry, but there is a difference between modified and damaged.

Don't get me wrong, I'm 99.99% sure Max did not do anything to the wing other than touch it. But the key here is he DID touch it and there IS a chance it could have done something.

No, there is not a chance it could have done something. Especially not to a wrongly adjusted end stopper.

[scheffers]

Hahaha comments on Max sabotaging or possibilities for sabotaging the wing with two fingers pinched together in 1 second are funny.

You're TOTALLY missing the point.

I understand very well what points are made. Some comments are just utter bullshit, mentioning technical impossible stuff.

[F1NAC]

Max messed up. It's not a matter of if he can damage the wing with a few touches.
It's a matter of sabotage is possible.
The wing is carbon but the hinges dont have to be. Also we do not know what he could have done, maybe move the lower wing down on its fixings. The point is as stated before there was tampering by an unauthorized party and so the case is spoiled. Max's own inexperience costinf his team.
Vettel never touches in parc ferme. He looks. When he does touch it's they tyre and outside of parc ferme.
I think this lets mercedes off the hook and max willl get a reprimand.
It's just not right for him to be touching the car especially the part in question. It can be construed that he was instructed by his team to sabotage the wing.
And i do believe it's possible for him to compromise the wing by squeezing parts of it. A mm is such a small distance.
If he squeezes it at a point it was not designed to be loaded it can be compromised.
A wing sees a uniformly distributed load. A squeeze is a point load. We do not know her mercedes designed their wings. So Max unfortunately can be said to be the cause of the failure even though it's unlikely. The thing is it is possible.

100% this.

It was a slam dunk penalty for Hamilton until Max touched it.

He touched it, therefore causing a chance (no matter how small) that he damaged the wing. In a court, that chance is all you would need.

These 2 posts will probably get burried but this is perfect explanation to the whole situation.

[LM10]

Imagine a few of the best engineers in the world seriously trying to convince the stewards of Max having damaged the wing by gently touching it and then the stewards believing what they’ve just heard. A funny imagination.

[f1jcw]

Hahaha comments on Max sabotaging or possibilities for sabotaging the wing with two fingers pinched together in 1 second are funny.

You're TOTALLY missing the point.

I understand very well what points are made. Some comments are just utter bullshit, mentioning technical impossible stuff.

Okay 2 cyclists are going for the WDC.
They both have urine tests and one has failed.

There is video of the competitor touching the sample bottle, he might not have done anything but as it was done before the tests it casts doubt on the results of the test.


Max doesn't have to have done anything but he has cast doubt on the whole procedure.

If FIA do punish Lewis, I think merc will appeal and it will go one after the race.

[f1jcw]

Imagine a few of the best engineers in the world seriously trying to convince the stewards of Max having damaged the wing by gently touching it and then the stewards believing what they’ve just heard. A funny imagination.

They don't have to.

The test follows a strict procedure. This procedure has not being followed.

[wogx]

HAM & VER aren't using DRS in P2

[jumpingfish]

Should Mercedes provide reliable evidence that human touch damages an initially durable wing? Have a test: examine the wing, then the technical inspector touches, investigate again. Easily? Or should the inspectors believe that everything was as Mercedes claim?