2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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Big Tea
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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Mattchu wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 4:16 pm
Hoffman900 wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:24 am
fritticaldi wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 4:14 am
Hamilton already making up excuses. He said Pirelli tyres are not good. They need more grip. Reality the Mercedes weakest link is fast curves. This car is ill conceived. If the FIA bans their spaceship mirrors this will set them back 2 or 3 tenths slower.
Thanks for the expert analysis.

Honestly, if the cars look like they have in testing, I think I'll be watching a lot more Indy Car this year. They aren't exciting on tv and look like they handle like dump trucks in the slow stuff (relative to how they use to, and especially compared to 15-20 years ago).
Yep after watching quite a bit of testing these new cars do nothing for me at all, they don`t look nimble or agile, more like Maybachs! The big rims/tyres look stupid, the rear wing like an ice cream scoop, front not much better and don`t get me started on them blinkin wheel covers! Whose idea was it to take one of the most promenant visually appealing features of F1 cars (the OZ, BBS, etc wheels) and replace them with some ridiculous plate things that just look awful!

Rant over :)

And they still have/need DRS, which I thought was the whole point
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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Big Tea
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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JPower wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 4:32 pm
variante wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 4:24 pm

Even ignoring the aforementioned indicators, Ferrari beat either RedBull or Mercedes 5 times during such period. There's no reason to believe they can't do that again, or better.
Agreed. I don't understand the underrating of Ferrari during the turbo hybrid era. Some people make it sound like Red Bull has been in another league during that time frame when that's clearly not the case.

I get that Ferrari has been down over the last 2 years but I see that as an anomaly more than a trend.

Not to say Ferrari is a championship contender this year, we don't know for sure, but it wouldn't be surprising at this point.
The main problem with Ferrari is not they shoot them selves in the foot, but they blow their own legs off so often.
There are very few years that they should be there abouts, even when they are not.
The problems seem to stem from upper management, and I don't mean the one at the trackside
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

JPower
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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Big Tea wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:00 pm
JPower wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 4:32 pm
variante wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 4:24 pm

Even ignoring the aforementioned indicators, Ferrari beat either RedBull or Mercedes 5 times during such period. There's no reason to believe they can't do that again, or better.
Agreed. I don't understand the underrating of Ferrari during the turbo hybrid era. Some people make it sound like Red Bull has been in another league during that time frame when that's clearly not the case.

I get that Ferrari has been down over the last 2 years but I see that as an anomaly more than a trend.

Not to say Ferrari is a championship contender this year, we don't know for sure, but it wouldn't be surprising at this point.
The main problem with Ferrari is not they shoot them selves in the foot, but they blow their own legs off so often.
There are very few years that they should be there abouts, even when they are not.
The problems seem to stem from upper management, and I don't mean the one at the trackside
I agree.

Regarding 2022, we'll see. With PMI gone and management structure changes over the past 3 years, we'll see if there's a difference in that area. I think 2021 was a good start but we'll see what happens when the pressure is on.

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fritticaldi
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:57 am
djos wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 6:44 am
holeindalip wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 6:35 am


What’s wrong with the mirrors?
They are supposed to join the side of the tub, but they join to their down wash wing.
They are connected through a thin line of stay to the tub which is under the covering... if its so much of an issue then its very easy for merc to connect visibliy them with a very thin line of material to the tub. No performance lost. Its not as critical as people make it out to be
.
.

fritticaldi wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 4:14 am
Hamilton already making up excuses. He said Pirelli tyres are not good. They need more grip. Reality the Mercedes weakest link is fast curves. This car is ill conceived. If the FIA bans their spaceship mirrors this will set them back 2 or 3 tenths slower.
Please post the exact source and quote for it please.
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... f1s-new-18

shamyakovic
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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fritticaldi wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:32 pm
shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:57 am
djos wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 6:44 am


They are supposed to join the side of the tub, but they join to their down wash wing.
They are connected through a thin line of stay to the tub which is under the covering... if its so much of an issue then its very easy for merc to connect visibliy them with a very thin line of material to the tub. No performance lost. Its not as critical as people make it out to be
.
.

fritticaldi wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 4:14 am
Hamilton already making up excuses. He said Pirelli tyres are not good. They need more grip. Reality the Mercedes weakest link is fast curves. This car is ill conceived. If the FIA bans their spaceship mirrors this will set them back 2 or 3 tenths slower.
Please post the exact source and quote for it please.
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... f1s-new-18
So Vettel also said this
“I think everyone’s sliding around and we all seem to have a little bit less grip than before,” he said. “The tyres are worse this year.

But you said it was Lewis saying this as an excuse and it was Mercedes which is the weakest link.

But you did not mention about Vettel. So its an issue for others aswell.

LM10
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:39 pm
fritticaldi wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:32 pm
shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:57 am


They are connected through a thin line of stay to the tub which is under the covering... if its so much of an issue then its very easy for merc to connect visibliy them with a very thin line of material to the tub. No performance lost. Its not as critical as people make it out to be
.
.



Please post the exact source and quote for it please.
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... f1s-new-18
So Vettel also said this
“I think everyone’s sliding around and we all seem to have a little bit less grip than before,” he said. “The tyres are worse this year.

But you said it was Lewis saying this as an excuse and it was Mercedes which is the weakest link.

But you did not mention about Vettel. So its an issue for others aswell.
Only for Lewis and Seb for all we know. All the others who have been asked were positive about the new tyres.

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NicoS
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:39 pm
fritticaldi wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:32 pm
shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:57 am


They are connected through a thin line of stay to the tub which is under the covering... if its so much of an issue then its very easy for merc to connect visibliy them with a very thin line of material to the tub. No performance lost. Its not as critical as people make it out to be
.
.



Please post the exact source and quote for it please.
https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... f1s-new-18
So Vettel also said this
“I think everyone’s sliding around and we all seem to have a little bit less grip than before,” he said. “The tyres are worse this year.

But you said it was Lewis saying this as an excuse and it was Mercedes which is the weakest link.

But you did not mention about Vettel. So its an issue for others aswell.
Yes, but he spoke about Lewis in particular, not Vettel. So not sure why you mention Vettel?

shamyakovic
shamyakovic
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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NicoS wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:42 pm
shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:39 pm
So Vettel also said this
“I think everyone’s sliding around and we all seem to have a little bit less grip than before,” he said. “The tyres are worse this year.

But you said it was Lewis saying this as an excuse and it was Mercedes which is the weakest link.

But you did not mention about Vettel. So its an issue for others aswell.
Yes, but he spoke about Lewis in particular, not Vettel. So not sure why you mention Vettel?
Çoz he was saying "Lewis is making excuses"
But infact its same for another team and another driver.
So he conveniently forgot about Vettel so they can have some hate comments against Lewis

shamyakovic
shamyakovic
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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LM10 wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:41 pm
shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:39 pm
So Vettel also said this
“I think everyone’s sliding around and we all seem to have a little bit less grip than before,” he said. “The tyres are worse this year.

But you said it was Lewis saying this as an excuse and it was Mercedes which is the weakest link.

But you did not mention about Vettel. So its an issue for others aswell.
Only for Lewis and Seb for all we know. All the others who have been asked were positive about the new tyres.
So are both of them making excuses (according to OP)
or is there a genuine problem?

koenigzig
koenigzig
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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We all know fastest times in testing don't mean a lot, so please take this "analysis" with a pinch of salt or 2. It is purely for fun/speculative purposes.

Methodology:
  • Fastest lap times per team, per day from the 2021 Bahrain preseason test
  • Then from those 3 days, determining the fastest lap overall for each team (Fastest Lap column)
  • Comparing these times to the fastest lap from 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix Qualifying. Green = quali time was faster than fastest time from testing, red = quali time was slower
  • Quantifying variance
Image

Looking at corresponding testing times from 2022, and applying the variance factor to come up with a speculative quali time for the 2022 race.
Image

Which gives us this pecking order:
Image

The whole exercise is purely based on how fast were teams in quali compared to their fastest times in the preseason test, and only using 2021 data. Williams didnt set a fast time probably due to their brake issue from Day 2 putting them on the backfoot - one example of how badly the data is skewed due to the simplistic nature of this exercise.

Red Bull, Ferrari, McLaren and Mercedes will be a lot closer together imo, can't wait to find out what the real pecking order is.Cheers
PM me if you're interested in joining an F1 2021 or Assetta Corsa Competizione league on Xbox

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NicoS
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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koenigzig wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:50 pm
We all know fastest times in testing don't mean a lot, so please take this "analysis" with a pinch of salt or 2. It is purely for fun/speculative purposes.

Methodology:
  • Fastest lap times per team, per day from the 2021 Bahrain preseason test
  • Then from those 3 days, determining the fastest lap overall for each team (Fastest Lap column)
  • Comparing these times to the fastest lap from 2021 Bahrain Grand Prix Qualifying. Green = quali time was faster than fastest time from testing, red = quali time was slower
  • Quantifying variance
https://postimg.cc/N9MFjVJf

Looking at corresponding testing times from 2022, and applying the variance factor to come up with a speculative quali time for the 2022 race.
https://postimg.cc/DJ8fTG0S

Which gives us this pecking order:
https://postimg.cc/23Lj9ngJ

The whole exercise is purely based on how fast were teams in quali compared to their fastest times in the preseason test, and only using 2021 data. Williams didnt set a fast time probably due to their brake issue from Day 2 putting them on the backfoot - one example of how badly the data is skewed due to the simplistic nature of this exercise.

Red Bull, Ferrari, McLaren and Mercedes will be a lot closer together imo, can't wait to find out what the real pecking order is.Cheers
Thanks! interesting read!
just a comment, you are putting yourself down too much. Your first sentence comes across as overly apologetic and leaves the perception that you are not confident in your analysis.
just state your claim, there will always be some that "talks" a lot and knows much more :)

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Artur Craft
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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NathanOlder wrote:
Sat Mar 12, 2022 5:49 pm
Right, also who the hell are Alpha Romeo ? #-o #-o #-o
That´s what you get when the teams name themselves as Alpha Tauri and Alfa Romeo or Aston Marting Racing Point.. whatever it´s called.

I still call them by Toro Rosso, Force India and Sauber :-"
shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 12:18 pm
4 times I remember
In 2017 - ferrari was equally fast until vettel blew it
In 2018 - and ferrari were very fast with their engine until vettal blew it
2019 - similar and ferrari were equally fast and almost won it
2021 - redbull was the fastest car.
Mercedes has been, confortably, the quickest car since 2014(WCC clearly displays that), including every single one of those years you mentioned :roll: But we all know what is behind that narrative you´re trying to push...

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Andres125sx
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:53 am
chrisc90 wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:27 am
lh13 wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:16 am
Younger doesn't mean faster. If Russell is not as talented as Hamilton, he'll always be slower, regardless of his age. We'll see what happens. Russell can be faster than Hamilton in 2022, but at the same time, its possible that he'll not be - Or allowed to be

Sent from my 21061119AG using Tapatalk
Cleared it up a bit more for you.
Really? Merc since 2014 is the only team who have allowed their driver to race each other...
Sorry couldn´t read anymore from this point, it became too comic for this early hour in the morning :lol: :lol: :lol:

:roll:

Watto
Watto
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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I think its great that it looks like battle between Merc, Ferrari and RB will make for a good season if it does, probably a few that look like they may push. But I think its hard to be certain who will win the driver and constructors championships is great to have

shamyakovic
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Re: 2022 Winter Testing Part 2: Bahrain International Circuit 10-12th March

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Andres125sx wrote:
Mon Mar 14, 2022 7:50 am
shamyakovic wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:53 am
chrisc90 wrote:
Sun Mar 13, 2022 11:27 am


Cleared it up a bit more for you.
Really? Merc since 2014 is the only team who have allowed their driver to race each other...
Sorry couldn´t read anymore from this point, it became too comic for this early hour in the morning :lol: :lol: :lol:

:roll:
So nico rosberg and Lewis Hamilton were they in different teams from 2014 to 2016? #-o
Sorry couldn't read anymore from this point, it is become too much hate for this late hour in the morning :lol: :lol:

:wtf: