Red Bull RB18

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter does not belong here.
RGAEDA
RGAEDA
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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I think the driver can see it in the rearview mirrors. Check this video out from 2018 when the rear wings were sitting low, I'm not sure whether it's the camera angle or it's the normal case but we can see the rear wing in the right rearview mirror.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5y243oh2Ryw


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AeroDynamic
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Location: La règle du jeu

Re: Red Bull RB18

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Image

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SiLo
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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I'm still very intrigued as to the purpose of this spring looking contraption at this part of the car. I can only assume the bib can actually flex somewhat under load and this stop it from snapping. So if they go over a curb hard this flexes the floor rather than having a rigid section that would just break.
Felipe Baby!

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Zynerji
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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SiLo wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 1:21 pm
I'm still very intrigued as to the purpose of this spring looking contraption at this part of the car. I can only assume the bib can actually flex somewhat under load and this stop it from snapping. So if they go over a curb hard this flexes the floor rather than having a rigid section that would just break.
If that was all it did, wouldn't a simple coil spring suffice?

matteosc
matteosc
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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SiLo wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 1:21 pm
I'm still very intrigued as to the purpose of this spring looking contraption at this part of the car. I can only assume the bib can actually flex somewhat under load and this stop it from snapping. So if they go over a curb hard this flexes the floor rather than having a rigid section that would just break.
Yes, the bib touches the ground quite often, not only on curbs. The spring and the associated damper are used to manage this impacts.

matteosc
matteosc
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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Zynerji wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 2:13 pm
SiLo wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 1:21 pm
I'm still very intrigued as to the purpose of this spring looking contraption at this part of the car. I can only assume the bib can actually flex somewhat under load and this stop it from snapping. So if they go over a curb hard this flexes the floor rather than having a rigid section that would just break.
If that was all it did, wouldn't a simple coil spring suffice?
You also need some sort of damping to prevent the bib from starting oscillating.

TimW
TimW
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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Zynerji wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 2:13 pm
SiLo wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 1:21 pm
I'm still very intrigued as to the purpose of this spring looking contraption at this part of the car. I can only assume the bib can actually flex somewhat under load and this stop it from snapping. So if they go over a curb hard this flexes the floor rather than having a rigid section that would just break.
If that was all it did, wouldn't a simple coil spring suffice?
It looks like a stack of belleville washers and an adjustment nut. It does not get much simpler than that. With a coil spring you would get much lower spring rates.

Edit: @matteosc, the inherit damping of the bib material and spring stack will be enough to prevent unwanted oscillation.

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Big Tea
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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SiLo wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 1:21 pm
I'm still very intrigued as to the purpose of this spring looking contraption at this part of the car. I can only assume the bib can actually flex somewhat under load and this stop it from snapping. So if they go over a curb hard this flexes the floor rather than having a rigid section that would just break.
Still puts me in mind of a mass damper.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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Zynerji
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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Big Tea wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 3:02 pm
SiLo wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 1:21 pm
I'm still very intrigued as to the purpose of this spring looking contraption at this part of the car. I can only assume the bib can actually flex somewhat under load and this stop it from snapping. So if they go over a curb hard this flexes the floor rather than having a rigid section that would just break.
Still puts me in mind of a mass damper.
I think a mass damper is only really effective if it's cantilevered over the axles (front or rear, not midship).

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Big Tea
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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Zynerji wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 3:10 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 3:02 pm
SiLo wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 1:21 pm


I'm still very intrigued as to the purpose of this spring looking contraption at this part of the car. I can only assume the bib can actually flex somewhat under load and this stop it from snapping. So if they go over a curb hard this flexes the floor rather than having a rigid section that would just break.
Still puts me in mind of a mass damper.
I think a mass damper is only really effective if it's cantilevered over the axles (front or rear, not midship).
Not even to dam proposing swings?
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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Zynerji
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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Big Tea wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 3:31 pm
Zynerji wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 3:10 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 3:02 pm


Still puts me in mind of a mass damper.
I think a mass damper is only really effective if it's cantilevered over the axles (front or rear, not midship).
Not even to dam proposing swings?
I think it would need to be behind the rear axle to damp the porpoising if it was a mass damper...

marcel171281
marcel171281
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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A mass damper this small at this location to counteract the forces of the porpoising? Forget it, not going to happen.

matteosc
matteosc
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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TimW wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 2:41 pm
Zynerji wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 2:13 pm
SiLo wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 1:21 pm


I'm still very intrigued as to the purpose of this spring looking contraption at this part of the car. I can only assume the bib can actually flex somewhat under load and this stop it from snapping. So if they go over a curb hard this flexes the floor rather than having a rigid section that would just break.
If that was all it did, wouldn't a simple coil spring suffice?
It looks like a stack of belleville washers and an adjustment nut. It does not get much simpler than that. With a coil spring you would get much lower spring rates.

Edit: @matteosc, the inherit damping of the bib material and spring stack will be enough to prevent unwanted oscillation.
It is possible, but not necessarily always true. If a team has a damper, it probably is necessary, at least in their case.

matteosc
matteosc
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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Zynerji wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 3:48 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 3:31 pm
Zynerji wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 3:10 pm


I think a mass damper is only really effective if it's cantilevered over the axles (front or rear, not midship).
Not even to dam proposing swings?
I think it would need to be behind the rear axle to damp the porpoising if it was a mass damper...
Agree, it would not do much at the bib. Also, mass dampers are illegal.

shady
shady
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Re: Red Bull RB18

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Can someone explain this mechanically? Its probably the largest spring/damper on the car and they have rarely been there before. the t-tray stay was always a thin rod for stiffness, but the rules allow this new spring setup but why, curbs is it? Mitigating some form of compression between the monocoque and the floor, but the floor is only allowed to 'lightly' scrape across the track anyway or is the floor that stiff now it can resist the compression from above (what is generating DF in that area as its the entrance to the tunnel) come to think of it, its probably to keep the front of the floor from lifting...