2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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ismail1991
ismail1991
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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ringo wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:45
ismail1991 wrote:
04 May 2025, 23:52
dia6olo wrote:
04 May 2025, 23:44
The car is looking worse with each passing weekend!
I have to say that Lewis is very childish! And I would add that in the end, with a huge helping hand from the strategists, Lewis cost Leclerc a shot at Antonelli!
I wouldnt agree with that. Lewis always tried to help the team previous races. He let leclerc go in China without teams asking. He had better tires he should have been let earlier by the team. He cooked his medium tires behind leclerc. Second swap happened when ham was only 2.2 behind. It was for nothing at the end. Ferrari is hopeless at managing this stuff. It was the same between Sainz - Leclerc. It will be the same between leclerc and hamilton. Ferrar strategists results this things happening. Btw I was thinking Sainz was more at fault but now thinking leclerc was the same To Sainz also
Leclerc was whining unnecessarily over the radio, guilt tripping the team about the swap.
Lewis was indeed right about the strategy. He had the softs and earned the right to use the full pace. Where Lewis joined Charles in the whining was when he asked if he should let Sainz by too. :lol:
But I think he knew that it was not the right time to swap. The right time would be at the end. He could have come within DRS of Antonelli, but I dont think he would have passed. Neither would. Car is just best of the rest right now.
I agree mate👍👍
Last edited by ismail1991 on 05 May 2025, 00:57, edited 1 time in total.

Luscion
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Fred -
"Now there will be a week-long break and then Formula 1 will return to Europe, with the first of the two Italian races, and Ferrari will have to try to redeem itself at Imola, where Frederic Vasseur is convinced that we will see a better SF-25. Will it also be supported by developments? "We will have something to take a small step forward and then there will be another step in Barcelona" he declared in the post-race interview with Sky Sport F1, but the focus should not be on developments "We need to find the best compromise with the car and put everything together"
https://autoracer.it/it/vasseur-miami-f ... barcellona

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catent
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Broken record ... it's totally a ride height issue.

My guess:

They saw the red flags in Australia and took precautions by raising the ride height mid-weekend.

Come Shanghai, they decide to see if their models are correlating with what is actually occurring on track and run the car at/near its optimal ride height (at least for the Sprint), and they again ran into plank wear issues.

From that point forward they've fully realized they must raise the car (at some tracks more than others) and its fallen off a cliff.

CjC
CjC
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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ScuderiaLeo wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:49
CjC wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:41
Glimmer of hope from Lewis, he says they know where they are lacking and are just waiting for a fix to come
I don't think he meant the fix is coming soon unfortunately, just that they know what the problem is. Which is the same as Leclerc said, they know the problem but that doesn't mean they'll fix it right now.



* Not sure if this is the same interview you're talking about, if there's a different one let me know.
It was his post race interview with Rachel Brooks on Sky F1
Just a fan's point of view

Luscion
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Lewis again saying the know what the issue is, theyre just waiting on a fix. maybe imola is the start of that


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ScuderiaLeo
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Luscion wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:57
Fred -
"Now there will be a week-long break and then Formula 1 will return to Europe, with the first of the two Italian races, and Ferrari will have to try to redeem itself at Imola, where Frederic Vasseur is convinced that we will see a better SF-25. Will it also be supported by developments? "We will have something to take a small step forward and then there will be another step in Barcelona" he declared in the post-race interview with Sky Sport F1, but the focus should not be on developments "We need to find the best compromise with the car and put everything together"
https://autoracer.it/it/vasseur-miami-f ... barcellona
Vasseur: The focus shouldn't be on upgrades

The drivers: We need upgrades

Lol..

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ScuderiaLeo
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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How can they admit Sainz had no claim to the racing line then go and say it was partially Hamilton's fault too? How is it Hamilton's fault at all that Sainz attempted a lunge he would've never succeeded in?

I'm glad Hamilton didn't get a penalty but it's ridiculous they even considered it.

ismail1991
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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ScuderiaLeo wrote:
05 May 2025, 01:07


How can they admit Sainz had no claim to the racing line then go and say it was partially Hamilton's fault too? How is it Hamilton's fault at all that Sainz attempted a lunge he would've never succeeded in?

I'm glad Hamilton didn't get a penalty but it's ridiculous they even considered it.
As a Lewis fan, I have noticed early turn-in from lewis. On the other hand, Sainz clearly had a dive bomb. I was a little bit worried because Uncle Derek was the steward as far as I know

dialtone
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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ScuderiaLeo wrote:
Luscion wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:57
Fred -
"Now there will be a week-long break and then Formula 1 will return to Europe, with the first of the two Italian races, and Ferrari will have to try to redeem itself at Imola, where Frederic Vasseur is convinced that we will see a better SF-25. Will it also be supported by developments? "We will have something to take a small step forward and then there will be another step in Barcelona" he declared in the post-race interview with Sky Sport F1, but the focus should not be on developments "We need to find the best compromise with the car and put everything together"
https://autoracer.it/it/vasseur-miami-f ... barcellona
Vasseur: The focus shouldn't be on upgrades

The drivers: We need upgrades

Lol..
I think he’s saying that because the car is compromised and they need to work with what they have.

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deadhead
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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catent wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:57
Broken record ... it's totally a ride height issue.

My guess:

They saw the red flags in Australia and took precautions by raising the ride height mid-weekend.

Come Shanghai, they decide to see if their models are correlating with what is actually occurring on track and run the car at/near its optimal ride height (at least for the Sprint), and they again ran into plank wear issues.

From that point forward they've fully realized they must raise the car (at some tracks more than others) and its fallen off a cliff.
No way man! that's truly a colossal mistake if true and also if you think about it they've been pretty much lost on this front since the FIA passed TD039 3 years ago? :|

Sphere3758
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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deadhead wrote:
05 May 2025, 06:58
catent wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:57
Broken record ... it's totally a ride height issue.

My guess:

They saw the red flags in Australia and took precautions by raising the ride height mid-weekend.

Come Shanghai, they decide to see if their models are correlating with what is actually occurring on track and run the car at/near its optimal ride height (at least for the Sprint), and they again ran into plank wear issues.

From that point forward they've fully realized they must raise the car (at some tracks more than others) and its fallen off a cliff.
No way man! that's truly a colossal mistake if true and also if you think about it they've been pretty much lost on this front since the FIA passed TD039 3 years ago? :|
The fact that Lewis mentioned that “ they’ve known what the issue is since Shanghai” makes it quite clear that @catent is right.

Even if they manage to fix it, they are too far gone imo. McLaren is yet to bring an upgrade and all the other top teams are going to make another step soon too

Space-heat
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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codetower wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:29
Neither driver was gonna catch Antonelli no matter when/if they swapped. Hamilton‘s medium was one lap older than Charles‘s hard. His tires would’ve fallen off anyway. They were hesitant because they knew this. It was only a matter of appeasing Lewis. I think the swap back to having Charles as the lead car was the right call. He qualified ahead of him, was faster than him throughout the race, it was the right thing to do.


After a few years of Sainz v Charles I am done with inter driver battles on here.

However, Ferrari lost 3 second switching LEC and Hamilton twice (maybe more). Vanja said he'll do an analysis on Twitter so we can see what that turns up. 3 seconds would have got LEC to Kimi.

Guessing, Ferrari delayed the Hamilton switch as Sainz was so close.
ringo wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:45
Leclerc was whining unnecessarily over the radio, guilt tripping the team about the swap.
Lewis was indeed right about the strategy. He had the softs and earned the right to use the full pace. Where Lewis joined Charles in the whining was when he asked if he should let Sainz by too. :lol:
But I think he knew that it was not the right time to swap. The right time would be at the end. He could have come within DRS of Antonelli, but I dont think he would have passed. Neither would. Car is just best of the rest right now.
This is so incorrect, it is just amazing. Go listen to Charle's onboard and then compare to Lewis. He got out of the way, like 2 seconds after getting told by Bryan on the first switch.

He complained that they did not tell him how close Sainz was to Lewis. He might have had one other comment on Lewis needs to go faster after 2-3 laps following. Then when Bryan asked about pace in clear air, he was clearly done. He even said not to bother with the switch back and to focus on Lewis getting Kimi and they'd talk post race.

You can be a fan of Lewis but please don't take the snippets sky or F1tv feed you and assume it tells the full story.

Sevach
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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The whole thing.

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Vanja #66
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Lately, I'm unable to read the forum properly because of consistent Error 503, so I'm just taking this chance to repost my analysis on the whole disasterclass yesterday with team orders



🟥 Ferrari's Team Order Drama - Long Thread🟥

AKA - How they failed to get both cars ahead of Antonelli

AKA - "What the --- was even that?!?" Award in 2025 already goes to Ferrari

So, when we look at the Laps 34-57, we see some interesting stuff right away

🔸 Ferrari moved Leclerc even though they were both catching Antonelli consistently and even though Leclerc was in lower PU mode (we will see later)
🔸 Antonelli and Hamilton were very inconsistent in clean air, while Leclerc was quite consistent in dirty air, even though more often without DRS
🔸 Leclerc demonstrated he had a lot of pace in hand, gaining 1s over Antonelli in just 2 laps after 15 laps of pushing in dirty air

Image

If we compare Hamilton's laps in clean air on Mediums vs Leclerc's laps in dirty air on Mediums (1st Stint behind Sainz) we see significant inconsistency in overpass section, while also having inconsistency in S1 with a big mistake on T2 exit on Lap 47

On lap 28, Leclerc demonstrated how much more pace he had in S1 once he got released from Sainz since lap 26 - fun fact, not relevant in this analysis

Image

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Now if we compare Leclerc's laps 38 (let HAM pass) and next 2 laps, we see 2 things

🔸 On lap 39 he suffered a lot in S1, first lap in dirty air on Hards
🔸 On lap 40 he already corrected his line (started going tighter to avoid some part of dirty air), pushed a bit more and ran an equal S1 as in clean air

This means only 1 thing, as he later confirmed in his interview - he wasn't pushing too much in early laps and wanted to get his tyres into right window because there were 20 laps to catch and overtake Antonelli. He also WASN'T using regular PU mode and he was probably saving some fuel as well since he wasn't pushing in high-speed to get his tyres into window properly

WE MUST PUT AN EMPHASIS ON THIS POINT - these two pieces of information are crucial, and Ferrari must have known Leclerc had 3-4 tenths a lap in hand that he can use very quickly. On lap 38 he was 5.0s behind Antonelli when he lifted and lost 1.5s there

Hamilton couldn't pass Leclerc without being let go, even though he had DRS, quicker tyres and higher PU mode. This situation is a sign that without the DRS the car behind does not have significant pace advantage. Often in years before, Sainz was pushing in early laps and got in DRS behind Leclerc only to be dropped a few laps later - which is why Ferrari let them race and didn't let him pass on Team Orders. Albon took Sainz earlier in Stint 1 and they were on same tyres and against Team Orders - this is an example of what it means when a driver has clear pace advantage in the same car

Due to Hamilton's pressure, Ferrari succumbed even though they never did this with Sainz and shouldn't have done it this time either - rightfully

Like I said, already before this point Hamilton didn't have clear pace advantage because he couldn't pass on his own and telling Leclerc to let him go was clearly a mistake. This was done with 18 laps left and Leclerc would clearly be able to catch Antonelli easily because he had 3-4 tenths in hand once he got the required heat cycle in his Hards. Hamilton would have also taken Antonelli by following Leclerc in DRS on straights and carefully saving tyres in corners

All of this is clear even without taking into account how far behind Leclerc Hamilton was in previous 5 races - which really should have been a clear "No, don't do it!" for Ferrari's pit wall

Image

When we compare Hamilton's laps behind and ahead of Leclerc, we can see that

🔸 he did lose a lot behind Leclerc in overpass mostly
🔸 he did, however, gain even more than that with DRS and higher PU mode than Leclerc on straights
🔸 he DIDN'T shoot his tyres for couple of laps behind Leclerc as he was able to go a lot quicker in corners right away

Within 2 laps it was clear as day Hamilton does not have a pace advantage on Mediums and the swap was a mistake - because Leclerc was keeping up in dirty air even without DRS!

Experienced viewers understood this even before the swap - even without live telemetry that teams have. This period was a chance for a decisive swap back that could have given Leclerc a chance to catch and take Antonelli

Image

When we now compare subsequent laps (40, 44 and 51) between these two, we see that Leclerc is able to hold his own in overpass and sometimes even equal Hamilton in this most crucial section

Since Lap 46, Hamilton is back on normal PU mode and by Lap 51 Leclerc is already regularly in DRS and suffering in S1 and overpass section while being too close

Having Hards vs Mediums hampered Leclerc in T8 and T16, costing him valuable traction and he was unable to use DRS to pass Hamilton because of it - this is the opposite of what the situation should have been if Hamilton had a big pace advantage on laps 34-37. He would have been able to use softer tyres and higher PU mode easily if he had a big pace advantage.

Image

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Finally, we saw that Leclerc had a mega pace advantage over Antonelli in the final laps and even bigger advantage over Hamilton

In the final lap, he made a smaller dent on Antonelli as he was already suffering a bit in dirty air, being 1.5s behind him in S1. Despite of this, he was very consistent in those final 4 laps in S2 and S3. If this happened 10 laps earlier, as was expected considering this pace advantage - Hamilton would have been able to take Antonelli too easily

Contrary, Hamilton shot his Mediums and was significantly slower than Leclerc all across the lap in the final 7-8 laps

Image

So, the Bad Ferrari Drama in short:

🔸During Laps 34-37 Leclerc was steadily bringing tyres into temperature window, which is important for Hards so they can be pushed to the limit in the next 20 or so laps without dropping off
🔸 Additionally, Leclerc used lower PU mode to save fuel and prepare for final 20 laps of chase to get P6, which was easily his
🔸 Despite Leclerc taking it easy in early laps, he was still making decent gains on Antonelli, and this would have been even bigger after lap 40 at the latest

Knowing this, Ferrari succumbed to Hamilton's pressure and let him go ahead. Then, in clean air

🔸 Hamilton had to use lower PU mode for a few laps, after pushing early in the stint to keep up with Leclerc
🔸 Hamilton pushed as much as he could in clean air, but was unable to shake off Leclerc or make big gains on Antonelli
🔸 Inconsistent laps in clean air only confirmed that Hamilton is far from being comfortable in Ferrari at the moment

My Final Verdict in 4 points:

🔸 Ferrari made a terrible mistake to underestimate Leclerc's pace, even though they must have had the data available to them
🔸 Ferrari must stop underestimating their faster driver at the moment or they will keep losing points and positions all season
🔸 Ferrari DID make the right call to wait until lap 38 to swap initially because otherwise Sainz would have used his chance and overtaken Leclerc while Hamilton was going through
🔸 Ferrari must accept that Hamilton is not able to get comfortable with SF25 at the moment and stop pandering him or they will keep losing points and positions all season
"If anyone was to ask for my opinion, which, I note, they're not..." - The Fellowship

#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
#BlessYouLaddie

Space-heat
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Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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j_ste wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:36
Luscion wrote:
05 May 2025, 00:32
Fred cant be serious...

"Fred Vasseur (Ferrari): "57 seconds behind the race leader? I think McLaren was on another planet today, but our pace was similar to that of Mercedes and Red Bull. I still believe in the car's potential. I don't think we maximized the balance yesterday."
I now understand Manchester United fans with ETH.

That’s a terrible quote.
This is crossover I did not need.