FIA Environmentally Sustainable Motor Sport Policy

[ISLAMATRON]

http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre/pr ... sus_ms.pdf

So it seems that from now on engine formulas will not be controlled by volumetric capacity but by energy consumption (which many on this board have called for but will now hate because the FIA have adopted).

Dont think it will have much effect on F1 until 2013 when the new engine regs come in unless that mandate a max fuel usage for the next couple of years.

some posts regarding this topic viewtopic.php?p=129769#p129769

[timbo]

it seems

Well, yeah. "It seems"...
See, English is not my first language, but rarely do I have problems reading any technical paper, while this... What they wanted to say? "Motor sport must move ..... to one of power per unit of energy"? Is that all?
Don't you think FIA would be better of having somebody more technical than a lawyer as a president?
Oh, and "Technology such as fly wheels reducing dependence on batteries and concentrating on ICE load shift proves to be the most promising way forward." is just hilarious.

See here http://www.xs4all.nl/~jcdverha/scijokes ... l#subindex

The following phrases, frequently found in technical writings, are defined
below for your enlightenment.

Phrase Translation
------------------------------------------------

It has been long known...............I haven't bothered to check the references
It is known..........................I believe
It is believed.......................I think
It is generally believed.............My collegues and I think
There has been some discussion.......Nobody agrees with me
It can be shown......................Take my word for it
It is proven.........................It agrees with something mathematical

[ISLAMATRON]

Is it your belief that Mosley is the only person who works in the entire FIA? Do you not think they may have more technical minded persons on the payroll? Would you not also think they he consults those people before making any decisions or statements?

Would Ferrari be better off with a more Technical minded president instead of that idiot Luca(they've won under his presidency... or should I say in spite of)?
Flav didnt seem very technically minded(won several championships)... Howwett is a complete idiot in all facets...

Ron was much maligned for his "Ronspeak"(which to me was allways more enjoyable and informative that Luca's or Flav's blabbering), and Frank is a villian in F1 these days, so having a technical background does not instantly endear you to everyone.

So it seems that to be effective someone should be well rounded, something that I believe Mosely has proven to be much more than Flav or Luca.

[timbo]

So, you say that was a clear and transparent press-release?

[Scotracer]

As long as it's enough fuel to produce 900BHP for an entire race distance, I be happy.



Oh and if they make a lot of noise.

[ISLAMATRON]

So, you say that was a clear and transparent press-release?

clear enough to me... the first sentence let me know what their main goal was.

[timbo]

So, you say that was a clear and transparent press-release?

clear enough to me... the first sentence let me know what their main goal was.

Yeah, but what about the rest?
Why is that there?

[Pup]

Those who know me from other forums will know that I've wanted exactly this for years. But I agree with Timbo that the press release is poorly worded, and continues the FIA's tradition of mixing politics in with everything.

I mean, exactly what evidence is hidden away with the FIA HQ that shows that flywheel based KERS systems are better than battery based ones? Williams can't even get theirs to work - how is that better? So this sounds more like a thank you to Frank for abandoning FOTA than anything else. Just my opinion of course.

Regardless, this shift does present problems with the FIA's cost-cutting position, doesn't it? Of course, I've always argued that the FIA isn't really all that interested in cost cutting, but that's a different matter. This is an extraordinarily expensive proposition.

[ISLAMATRON]

not if put in line with the new 2013 engine formula... look how much the teams chose to spend switching to the V-8's(a billion or more?) and that was supposedly just a matter of lopping off 2 cylinders... The manufacturers(or at least the ones that are left) will spend hundreds of millions designing the new 2013 lumps, it really wont cost them any more to tell them that instead of all out power they will have to consider fuel efficiency as well.

Williams flywheels system does work(it is currently being used on other platforms), it is just not as light as the systems currently in place(SF & McL), but if the energy restriction on KERS were lifted than it would be much more valuable than either of those systems, and would probably win in Abu Dhabi.

Look at this F1techinal report as to why many think flywheels are the preferred technology.
http://www.f1technical.net/articles/11805

And if you havent noticed WilliamsF1 is back in FOTA and a very vocal member of it.

[autogyro]

not if put in line with the new 2013 engine formula... look how much the teams chose to spend switching to the V-8's(a billion or more?) and that was supposedly just a matter of lopping off 2 cylinders... The manufacturers(or at least the ones that are left) will spend hundreds of millions designing the new 2013 lumps, it really wont cost them any more to tell them that instead of all out power they will have to consider fuel efficiency as well.

Williams flywheels system does work(it is currently being used on other platforms), it is just not as light as the systems currently in place(SF & McL), but if the energy restriction on KERS were lifted than it would be much more valuable than either of those systems, and would probably win in Abu Dhabi.

Look at this F1techinal report as to why many think flywheels are the preferred technology.
http://www.f1technical.net/articles/11805

And if you havent noticed WilliamsF1 is back in FOTA and a very vocal member of it.

It is Fota that is being devious. These teams have Kers systems that they are capitalizing on with road cars. Fota wants to keep control over this and that is the reason they forced Kers to be dropped.
I have a much more efficient system available for Kers use than either the Merc or the Ferrari systems, that would benefit a great deal from the Williams flywheel storage methods, if the regs were made more open for Kers use.
These FIA plans for the future are a breath of fresh air in the face of the greedy status quo car makers and the fossil fuel Dictators.
Max is exactly correct and always has been on these issues.

[autogyro]

As to cost cutting. Kers was always allowed development budgets outside the cost cut suggestions. The FIA see it as an essential development in motor racing to ensure the sports future and to directly effect and improve road vehicle development. Internal combustion engine development has all but been exhausted and frantically grasping at this straw is a dated and redundant position to take.
What ever IC engines are to be used in F1, the cost will be the same 'to high' for to little.

[machin]

I think a lot of that article makes a lot sense.... good to see some common sense being introduced! At last we'll see some proper technological advancement rather than microscopic improvement to ICE's that benefits nobody....

[RacingManiac]

Who uses flywheel KERS?

[WhiteBlue]

A sensible policy which should be usefull for guidance if the FIA retains an influential position in motor sport. It rests to be seen if that is the case. In the past we saw that good policies were abandoned in the heat of day to day tactical decisions. For reference read the common objectives of the FIA/GPMA.

[Pup]

not if put in line with the new 2013 engine formula... look how much the teams chose to spend switching to the V-8's(a billion or more?) and that was supposedly just a matter of lopping off 2 cylinders... The manufacturers(or at least the ones that are left) will spend hundreds of millions designing the new 2013 lumps, it really wont cost them any more to tell them that instead of all out power they will have to consider fuel efficiency as well.

Yes, but this kind of reg doesn't really work with an engine frieze, and it's the continuous development that will cost the bucks. Not that I mind. Spend it if you've got it.