F1 breakaway series?

[jenkF1]

Joe Saward had an interesting take on the situation. To boil it down to its essence :

Luca's boss is part of the NewsCorp syndicate.
CVC will want to sell at the highest possible price.
Threats of a break-away bring down the value of the business.
If CVC want to sell for a profit, they'd be wise to sell whilst the value is high.

Essentially, Luca's posturing is a shot across the bows of CVC : they could sell now for a tidy profit, or they could hold on to their investment and watch the value plummet.

I don't know how much stock to put into that theory, but I'd say it is more likely than a break-away series under the current circumstances.

Good points. I think Luca is thoroughly peeved with Turbos. Ferrari want their road cars to reflect F1 tech, and their customers don't want to hear a turbo in line 4 whirring in the back of a mid-engined supercar.

[DaveKillens]

Ferrari don't like the way things are going, especially the future downsizing of the engines. Ferrari don't manufacture or sell what they would be racing in Formula One, and the commonality between their Formula One cars and what the consumer can buy would widen to the point where the customer no longer identifies with the racing car.

It makes sense for BMW, Mercedes, and Renault because they would be constructing and selling engines similar in displacement and appearance to their race cars.

There has to some kind of link between the racing effort and the production cars, to many that is the justification for large corporations to drop millions of advertising dollars into Formula One racing.

I can agree that if the present trend continues, Ferrari has no reason to be in Formula One. But I do have issue in how they convey their concerns to the rest of the world. Threats, intimidation, and tantrums just don't impress me, and makes me question at how dignified and regal the management structure of are.

[xpensive]

I for one thinks Montezuma makes perfect sense, a promoter like CVC taking 50% of the money from the activity is pervers to put it mildly, which all stems from MrM giving away the commertcial rights to MrE for a plate of beans some years back.

MrE then made out like a bandit selling it to CVC (finally), why the need this absurd take in order to pay off their loans.

Montezuma also takes NBA as an xample, where the teams don't share the spoils with anyone, situation is the same with NHL, correct Dave?

It wouldn't be a breakaway series in any shape or form, it's just that businessmen like himself, Ron D and Mateschitz all realize they don't need neither CVC nor the FIA to run their racing series, certainly not at a cost of 50% of the money.

The ridicilous engine formula from 2013 just makes the justification so much easier?

50%, that's like the deal Elvis had with "Colonel" Tom Parker, Priscilla quickly realized she didn't need that...

[gridwalker]

The desire to set up a series makes perfect sense, but the commercial and contractual clauses that are in place between concorde signatories makes the idea impractical; there is no way that Ferrari (or any other FOTA member) could be seen as signing up to a breakaway series without incurring Bernie's wrath.

After the brinksmanship of 2009, it is said that no concorde signatory may take any practical steps towards setting up a new series to rival F1 before the current contractual period expires : this means that even the big boys with money for the best lawyers won't even be able to hint that they've signed up to a breakaway before the end of 2012.

With the significant lead-time required to set up a major series, it would mean no alternative series could be run before 2014, which would have a serious impact upon the television and sponsorship revenue that sustain smaller teams. No matter how appealing the idea may be, the reality is that the idea would be foolhardy when the current series will be up for sale eventually.

This is why I believe that Monty's mumblings are just an attempt to force Bernie's hand.

[jddh1]

I think following the model set by the NHL, NBA and other series here in the States would be beneficial to F1. These models have their own issues but losing 50% of their income to someone not doing anything for the sport is not one of them. The teams would not have to sit down every time to agree on a rule. They would set up a commissioner and an executive office for that. They would be paid entities elected by every so often by the teams. The commissioner would be in charge of promoting the series for the teams, find the tracks for the teams, train the race officials for the teams. In short, he/she would be working for the teams.

[bot6]

We're more talking about the teams taking over the commercial side of the sport from CVC than a breakaway here. They're not trying to make a second parallel series next to F1. They are just talking about not renewing the contract with CVC at the end of 2012. And apparently, there was a FOTA meeting and all teams seemed to like the idea.

http://www.planetf1.com/news/3213/69351 ... ate-Future

[Rob01]

If the teams do NOT sign the newest Concorde, then CVC owns nothing. Their 1.3 Billion dollar investment would fall flat on it's face. The teams are F1.

[xpensive]

I think following the model set by the NHL, NBA and other series here in the States would be beneficial to F1. These models have their own issues but losing 50% of their income to someone not doing anything for the sport is not one of them. The teams would not have to sit down every time to agree on a rule. They would set up a commissioner and an executive office for that. They would be paid entities elected by every so often by the teams. The commissioner would be in charge of promoting the series for the teams, find the tracks for the teams, train the race officials for the teams. In short, he/she would be working for the teams.

=D> Isn't this the way IRL operates and also how the old CART series was set up?

[DaveKillens]

Personally, I prefer the NA$CAR style, where it is a dictatorship and run from the top down. NA$CAR arrainges and promotes all the series, and negotiate TV deals. If you don't like it, there's the door. But they don't have a master, and their one and only concern is the stability and health of the series. Because of that, they always take into careful consideration needs of the fans, racers, teams, and sponsors, and arrive at a decision that is in the best interests of the health of the series.

Meanwhile, Bernie has many masters, and when he speaks, it's in their best interests. There's just to many hands in the pie, and pulling is all sorts of different directions.

[bhall]

Hey, it's Dave! With some some real talk, no less.

I fear it's all for naught as long as there's a country with (more or less) a burgeoning economy willing to pay Bernie's fees. And there seems to be no shortage of those.

There's simply too much money involved for any party to walk away from the present system.

[xpensive]

Either way, I cannot see the F1 community keep giving away 50% of the money for nothing two years from now.

Face it, CVC without MrE is nothing and by 2013, with the next Concord agreement, he will be 90 and change.

[bhall]

Is CVC/Ecclestone still servicing F1's debts? If so, one way or another, that will play a significant role in whatever happens next.

[xpensive]

Is CVC/Ecclestone still servicing F1's debts? If so, one way or another, that will play a significant role in whatever happens next.

The only relevant debt is CVC's loans to pay off MrE some years back. A Gigabuck and then some.

[WhiteBlue]

A break away is always a serious option if the leading teams are in agreement. The most likely scenario is a push to cut CVC's part of the F1 business. Teams are currently getting 65% but they still want more and the FiA would support them to get rid of Ecclestone and CVC.

In fact we know that the FiA has an obligation to sanction another series with the F1 teams and drivers under a new name and ownership. With the expiry of the 2009-2012 concord agreement the teams would be free to set up their own series. They would need to avoid to be associated with the activity before the end of 2012 because they have obligations to do so in the concord agreement.

There are some ways to get around that clause of course. An independent business could set up the new series and sort out all contractual details pending the failure of the running concord.

Alternatively the FiA could adjust their F2 series rules to open them for the F1 teams. However they do it they would have three months between January and April to sort the final detail. I positively think it is doable.

The question is whether it would be necessary. Most likely a compromise can be reached just by using the break away as a stick.

[Giblet]

Everyone is acting like a 16 year old couple who argue every 5 minutes and threaten to break up all the time. Both sides need to compromise for the long term and accept their marriage.

Think of the children!