Will FIA end up requiring silencers?

[Jersey Tom]

FiA is already using silencers as they slowly assassinate the sport. Pew, pew, pew!

[NowyszRacing6]

This is not something that should even be brought up! The noise of f1 engines is one of the most amazing things on earth (at least to racing fans), and it adds so much to the enjoyment of the sport. It would be so sad and wrong to think about taking it away, and I honestly don't understand the logic of anyone who would do that. If you compromise everything that might offend a few people, you lose what is pure and special, and i think that's true for a lot of things. Sorry if I sound a little harsh, but things like this just irritate me because these ideas threaten racing/purity/enjoyment/etc just to save people some slight annoyance if they're not a fan and are nearby, or dont like loud noises, or whatever it might be.

[Wideband mindeD]

I read an article in some import magazine where they tested the plug-in silencers on the dyno.

It was a 300hp impreza that they tested, and it lost a total of 12hp, and the noise was drastically reduced. The point of this post is that with the flat turbo sound, they could actually design a tuned exhaust plug that would reduce the painful parts of the exhaust, and enhance the better ones without giving up much power.

[garrett]

Silencers in F1 wouldn´t be necessary as the cars will be slightly quieter than now because of the turbocharger. SLIGHTLY!!!! [-o<

But what`s the problem? This is state of the art eg. at Le Mans and WEC for some years:

5.5 Exhaust system

Noise level : The sound emitted from each car must not exceed 110 dbA during the qualifying practices and the race.
The measurement will be made at 15 meters from the edge of the track.

110 dB(A) are fairly enough I would say, it`s the double noise level eg. of a street motorcycle. At Indy 500 this year, fine 128 dB(A) were measured, and they are using the same engine configuration as F1 will use from 2014 onwards. So, as every F1 engineer asked realting the noise affirmed the new engines could sound even better than the current ones (which are just noisy shriekers if you ask me - but that`s my opinion of course) I think we should believe them and relax. F1 is facing bigger troubles than the loss of about 10 dB(A)....

[Cold Fussion]

Silencers in F1 wouldn´t be necessary as the cars will be slightly quieter than now because of the turbocharger. SLIGHTLY!!!! [-o<

But what`s the problem? This is state of the art eg. at Le Mans and WEC for some years:

5.5 Exhaust system

Noise level : The sound emitted from each car must not exceed 110 dbA during the qualifying practices and the race.
The measurement will be made at 15 meters from the edge of the track.

110 dB(A) are fairly enough I would say, it`s the double noise level eg. of a street motorcycle. At Indy 500 this year, fine 128 dB(A) were measured, and they are using the same engine configuration as F1 will use from 2014 onwards. So, as every F1 engineer asked realting the noise affirmed the new engines could sound even better than the current ones (which are just noisy shriekers if you ask me - but that`s my opinion of course) I think we should believe them and relax. F1 is facing bigger troubles than the loss of about 10 dB(A)....

Where does your figure of double come from? In Australia the legal limit is 100db measured 1m away. 110 db is already 3x the sound level, and measured 15 times the distance away, and falloff is function distance squared.

[AlpineF1]

I'm already annoyed enough with the engine change, silencers would be a bad move, having never been to a grand prix i cant comment for that, but i have been to the red bull home run and the Renault world series in 2010 (lotus Renault showcar) both of those events i have stood not 12 feet away from the cars moving at a decent speed, i am off to the silverstone grand prix next year but just for FP1 and FP2 as i insisted i wanted to hear the V8's one last time but in a cost effective way in my opinion its part of the fun but its unfair to ridicule your opinion so...

[garrett]

Where does your figure of double come from? In Australia the legal limit is 100db measured 1m away. 110 db is already 3x the sound level, and measured 15 times the distance away, and falloff is function distance squared.

Concerning uncorrelated signals like noise you need 6 dB(A) for double energy in an objective way. In a subjective way concerning the psychoacoustic detection you need 10 dB(A) for double noise. That´s the difference.

If you mean the FIA standard noise regulations by the "legal limit" it´s actually measured 100 dB(A) at 4500 rpm 0,5 m away in an angle of 45 degrees from the exhaust. But it´s the limit only for offroad and some saloon racing.

But that´s not the method used any more at eg Hockenheim circuit or at 24 h of Le Mans because it´s inappropriate. Look at the directives from the german federation DMSB (it´s in german, but the graphics should speak for itself):

http://www.dmsb.de/downloads/2668/Dr.E. ... fahren.pdf

Don´t know how it is in Aussieland, but in the European Union, a car race is not permissible unless official approval has been obtained. And the laws are requiring noise reduction. Thus you have to consider the Council Directive 85/337/EWG from 27th of June 1985. (see page 2 of the DMSB paper). It states: The louder, the fewer days of race action is allowed (page 7). The measuring of the proximity stationary noise level as mentioned above (see graphics in page 14 and 15) was replaced by the measuring technique from a certain distance (from the grandstands or surroundings) when the car is in motion at full throttle and at high revs. So it´s the sound power of a source, not the noise pressure level. So the car HAS about 130 d(BA) on track at Le Mans, but 110 dB(A) 15 m away in a psychoacoustic manner as it is allowed because of the falloff. If it would have 150 dB(A) on track, it would be too loud.

Currently, there is an EU programme on the run further reducing car noise, which via United Nations should be established worldwide. So, altogether there is necessity to reduce car noise, otherwise race tracks will get into legal trouble.

having never been to a grand prix i cant comment for that, but i have been to the red bull home run...

And I guess you never attended a V6 turbo engine run in the year 2014. So that´s the reason why the whole "sound discussion" is completely useless.

[AlpineF1]

Anything that comes out of that engine wont compare to previous engines and not just that have you seen the performance drop!?

[Raptor22]

the noise will come down drastically with Turbo's as others have already mentioned.
But the for street circuits I can see that it may be a problem in future with noise coming under scrutiny all the time.
At our model airplane flying fields we're limited to 95dB. In comps we are limited to 93dB. zthat requires the use of tuned exhaust on any two stroke over 40cc.

If you've ever been in the back of the F1 garage when they fire up the unlimited V8's used prior to 2006 you'll understand how it may be intolerable and the use of eye plugs and earphonea are required.

[WhiteBlue]

This thread deals with a non issue IMHO. Nobody even discussed introducing silencers to F1. Where is this rumour coming from? Is this just another panic posting by someone who knows zero about the rule discussions? The FiA deliberately selected petrol technology in order to conserve the sound of the engines. Diesels would have been far better in order to maximize fuel conservation. But they would have required soot filters which makes them unsuitably quiet for F1. Hence the immediate decision in the engine working group some years ago to select petrol for the 2013 engines. That decision still stands even with the delay to 2014. And we know that all manufacturers have promised an impressive engine sound which would not be possible with silencers. I think this thread is ready for closure.

[G37Sam]

I was a garage scrutineer in Abu Dhabi in 2010, was assigned to the Renault F1 Garage, R30 back then, so I was there 10-12 hours day all through parc ferme.

Mechanics would gather around, put on their ear plugs and get ready to fire her up. That's when mine came off. Almost did my pants too

Combine that, with the exhaust fumes, and man.. I wouldn't have chosen another place to be that day on this entire planet.