Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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De Jokke
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Joined: 30 Mar 2009, 02:51

Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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I see your point, but challenge? Lewis would have won everything if it wasn't for his OZ dnf. What more does he need to do...

About Alonso, he is allround BUT he is slower than lewis, vettel, kimi and rosberg over a single lap.
Mercedes AMG + Hamilton => dreamteam!
If you can't beat'em, call Masi!

CBeck113
CBeck113
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Joined: 17 Feb 2013, 19:43

Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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De Jokke wrote:I see your point, but challenge? Lewis would have won everything if it wasn't for his OZ dnf. What more does he need to do...

About Alonso, he is allround BUT he is slower than lewis, vettel, kimi and rosberg over a single lap.
Exactly - how many races last one lap (Except Monaco :) )? His ability to keep the entire race in perspective while giving 100% throughout makes him so good, and has made Ferrari look much better over the past years. Lewis is on the best path to prove his talent, but has the same "problem" as Vettel has had - the best car on the grid. That will always leave room to question the merit (not in my opinion - you win, you're the best) but for fan debates.
“Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony!” Monty Python and the Holy Grail

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De Jokke
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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CBeck113 wrote:
De Jokke wrote:I see your point, but challenge? Lewis would have won everything if it wasn't for his OZ dnf. What more does he need to do...

About Alonso, he is allround BUT he is slower than lewis, vettel, kimi and rosberg over a single lap.
Exactly - how many races last one lap (Except Monaco :) )? His ability to keep the entire race in perspective while giving 100% throughout makes him so good, and has made Ferrari look much better over the past years. Lewis is on the best path to prove his talent, but has the same "problem" as Vettel has had - the best car on the grid. That will always leave room to question the merit (not in my opinion - you win, you're the best) but for fan debates.
I was talking about QWF, which is also part of racing and there he lacks severely in my opnion. But in the race, nando is there, true that. He made Ferrari look better, indeed, but so did Lewis with the Mclaren. Especially in 2009. Lewis has nothing more to prove in terms of talent, as he already did it in good to mediocre cars (2007-2013).
Mercedes AMG + Hamilton => dreamteam!
If you can't beat'em, call Masi!

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MercedesAMGSpy
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Joined: 18 Apr 2014, 17:39

Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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CBeck113 wrote:
De Jokke wrote:I see your point, but challenge? Lewis would have won everything if it wasn't for his OZ dnf. What more does he need to do...

About Alonso, he is allround BUT he is slower than lewis, vettel, kimi and rosberg over a single lap.
Exactly - how many races last one lap (Except Monaco :) )? His ability to keep the entire race in perspective while giving 100% throughout makes him so good, and has made Ferrari look much better over the past years. Lewis is on the best path to prove his talent, but has the same "problem" as Vettel has had - the best car on the grid. That will always leave room to question the merit (not in my opinion - you win, you're the best) but for fan debates.
At least Lewis has to fight with a good team mate and he has performed in dogs before this season. 20 years later people don't know how you did it, they will only say: hey you are two times world champion F1.

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De Jokke
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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I wonder what the gap with this car would be on the old Hockenheimring 8)
Mercedes AMG + Hamilton => dreamteam!
If you can't beat'em, call Masi!

johnsonwax
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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De Jokke wrote:I see your point, but challenge? Lewis would have won everything if it wasn't for his OZ dnf. What more does he need to do...
I think Constructor and Driver's World Championship would be appreciated by the boss. Zetsche wants his own Michael Schumacher. Maybe that's Hamilton but he has to earn that reputation.

Richard
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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De Jokke wrote:I don't get it....
It's a journalist trying to grab headlines with one selective quote. They succeeded because they caught your attention.
It's telling that they don't give the context of the whole interview or the question that was being answered.

Here's another headline. Hamilton says "Fernando Alonso is ...the best driver " http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2013/a ... s-hamilton

Isn't it great that the TP and driver are in complete agreement?

Hang on a second ... "Fernando Alonso describes former foe Lewis Hamilton as the strongest driver in F1" http://www1.skysports.com/f1/news/12474 ... iver-in-f1

I wish they'd make their minds up ....

Emerson.F
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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CBeck113 wrote:Lewis is on the best path to prove his talent, but has the same "problem" as Vettel has had - the best car on the grid. That will always leave room to question the merit (not in my opinion - you win, you're the best) but for fan debates.
He has never had the best car. Only this year was he able to win 3 races in a row for the first time.

In 2007 and 2008 the Ferrari's and Bmw's where equally as quick. And only matched the reigning 2 times WDC in his rookie year...Not a small feat.
2009 speaks for itself. No but's or ifs. Look at Mclaren now. the car in 2009 was far worse than the last two cars they build and he dragged that car to two wins by seasons end. On merit
2010 the Ferrari and Mclaren where behind Redbull all season.
2011 was even worse with Lewis claiming the only non-Redbull Pole of the season. He had some of his best wins in that Season. Germany and China where my favourite wins.
2012 Mclaren cost him at least 130 points, only mistake was Valencia with Maldonado. jamesallen had a good article about it on his site.
2013 beddding into a car with horrible tyrelife build around Schumacher and Rosberg. If it wasn't for the tyreblowout he wouldv'e had two wins instead of one.
2014 speaks for itself 4 poles , 4 wins.

Alonso qoute from 2012:
"Why do I say Hamilton is the strongest? Because it's what I think, it's my personal opinion and there is nothing political in that," said Alonso. "Lewis has always won races ever since he has been in Formula 1, even in years like 2009, when he had started the season with a car that was two seconds off the quickest.

Ps: One only has to look at his junior track record wich is fenomenal by any standard.
Supporting: Ham/Alo/Kimi/Ros/Seb/Hulk/Ric/Mag

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De Jokke
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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Emerson.F wrote:
CBeck113 wrote:Lewis is on the best path to prove his talent, but has the same "problem" as Vettel has had - the best car on the grid. That will always leave room to question the merit (not in my opinion - you win, you're the best) but for fan debates.
He has never had the best car. Only this year was he able to win 3 races in a row for the first time.

In 2007 and 2008 the Ferrari's and Bmw's where equally as quick. And only matched the reigning 2 times WDC in his rookie year...Not a small feat.
2009 speaks for itself. No but's or ifs. Look at Mclaren now. the car in 2009 was far worse than the last two cars they build and he dragged that car to two wins by seasons end. On merit
2010 the Ferrari and Mclaren where behind Redbull all season.
2011 was even worse with Lewis claiming the only non-Redbull Pole of the season. He had some of his best wins in that Season. Germany and China where my favourite wins.
2012 Mclaren cost him at least 130 points, only mistake was Valencia with Maldonado. jamesallen had a good article about it on his site.
2013 beddding into a car with horrible tyrelife build around Schumacher and Rosberg. If it wasn't for the tyreblowout he wouldv'e had two wins instead of one.
2014 speaks for itself 4 poles , 4 wins.

Alonso qoute from 2012:
"Why do I say Hamilton is the strongest? Because it's what I think, it's my personal opinion and there is nothing political in that," said Alonso. "Lewis has always won races ever since he has been in Formula 1, even in years like 2009, when he had started the season with a car that was two seconds off the quickest.

Ps: One only has to look at his junior track record wich is fenomenal by any standard.

This =D> =D> =D>
For me, Lewis is the best driver ever. I know you can't compare the different era's but if I had to chose one, it'll be him.
Mercedes AMG + Hamilton => dreamteam!
If you can't beat'em, call Masi!

Emerson.F
Emerson.F
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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De Jokke wrote: This =D> =D> =D>
For me, Lewis is the best driver ever. I know you can't compare the different era's but if I had to chose one, it'll be him.
It's maybe a bit to early to say that. Senna, Lauda, Prost, Fangio, Novulari and Schumi are amongst the best. In ten years we judge much better. As to now Lewis is my favourite driver together with Fred. Even some greats have no title like Sir Stirling Moss. Yet he is still considered one of the greatest f1 drivers.
Supporting: Ham/Alo/Kimi/Ros/Seb/Hulk/Ric/Mag

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De Jokke
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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Emerson.F wrote:
De Jokke wrote: This =D> =D> =D>
For me, Lewis is the best driver ever. I know you can't compare the different era's but if I had to chose one, it'll be him.
It's maybe a bit to early to say that. Senna, Lauda, Prost, Fangio, Novulari and Schumi are amongst the best. In ten years we judge much better. As to now Lewis is my favourite driver together with Fred. Even some greats have no title like Sir Stirling Moss. Yet he is still considered one of the greatest f1 drivers.
Could be, but he's (in my opinion) the better version of Senna:

*bloody quick
*fantastic overtaker (better than Senna)
*amazing defender
*"do or die" mentality: all or nothing: racing with his heart
*sensationally to watch (yep, despite the boring modern f1 races) - a pure racer
*ability to adapt (pirelli --- area tyre conservation despite being a pure racer) + (winning with a dog of a car)
*good character - charity stuff etc.
*BUT doesn't drive people of the road (senna '90 prost)
Mercedes AMG + Hamilton => dreamteam!
If you can't beat'em, call Masi!

elf341
elf341
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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He's got some way to go until you can put him in the list Emerson mentioned.
Vettel has 4 WDC and won the last 9 races of 2013 in a row, and yet people still hesitate to add his name to that list.

Ross Brawn put it best in an interview he gave early this year where he mentioned that Hamilton needs to learn that to dominate he needs to do more than just drive the car - that includes working very closely with engineers.
What we've seen so far this year is less "leave me alone" and more "tell me what I can do" on the radio - a step in the right direction!

beelsebob
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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elf341 wrote:He's got some way to go until you can put him in the list Emerson mentioned.
Vettel has 4 WDC and won the last 9 races of 2013 in a row, and yet people still hesitate to add his name to that list.
Right, in much the same way as people would hesitate to put Hamilton on the list simply for winning 9 races in a row in the W05.

Emerson.F
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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.....
Last edited by Emerson.F on 22 May 2014, 12:24, edited 1 time in total.
Supporting: Ham/Alo/Kimi/Ros/Seb/Hulk/Ric/Mag

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FoxHound
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Re: Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team 2014

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Can we focus on the team rather than debate drivers?
JET set