2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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i70q7m7ghw
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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I don't see how Rosberg can be defended there. Hamilton was ahead in to the corner, Hamilton gave him lots of room, and he still decided to drive straight in to the side of Hamilton's car. Maybe he was just frustrated by the mistake he made in T1?

From the teams point of view, Hamilton made the overtake on the outside and he gave plenty of space. Rosberg made a mistake out of T1, defended the inside, and then I'm guessing he tried to run Hamilton out of road. So who was the aggressive one in this situation? Hamilton had more speed, he went to the outside rather than fight for the inside, he gave plenty of space... what more could he have done? In this situation Hamilton did everything to avoid a crash and Rosberg did everything to cause one.
Last edited by i70q7m7ghw on 03 Jul 2016, 17:07, edited 1 time in total.

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NathanOlder
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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Alguck wrote:
F1NAC wrote:
Alguck wrote:Definitely, ROS made a mistake there (but having braking troubles), but HAM moved in strangely aggressively when it was clear already that ROS was not going to hit the apex.
Almost looks like he's going for Nico's frontwing, very dodgy move. Seems like he succeeded. Pulling a Jerez 97 there?
Well if rosberg was infront that would be very similar, but here Hamilton was the guy in front.
Difficult to catch just using Youtube now but this is pretty much where Lewis decided to turn in:
http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?fi ... 555919.png

He's not in front and he should see Nico coming.
Lewis WAS in front and Nico went sailing in on the DIRTY line with BAD brakes!
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dans79
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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Any word yet from the stewards if Nico is getting a penalty or not?
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i70q7m7ghw
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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Nico wasn't braking at that point. Bad brakes is just a smokescreen, if he had "no brakes" he would have just gone straight on in to the run off. He had the grip to make the corner, he didn't turn the steering wheel.

sosic2121
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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So, now Nico knows what to do when someone pushes you of the road. He's a slow learner but he's getting there. Best race driver/car combo, just not asshole enough. Yet :-D

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Racer X
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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So right at the end Perez with a break failure that promoted who ever was in 11th to 10th and making it a bad week end to join his teammate on a DNF.

With Ross also right at the end in collision with Hamilton almost making it a bad day for Mercedes as well so their lucky they got the 1st and 4th they got.

It could have been a pair of DNF and I have to agree with Hamilton they were as far out as they could have been out on on that particular turn.

What did Rosberg want Hamilton to do?
Leave the track out entirely?
The way i see it either Nico intended to crash Hamilton or Nico simply had a car issue either way Hamilton had no where else to go.
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Fulcrum
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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Phil wrote:
Fulcrum wrote:Did he have brand new Soft tyres or brand new Supersoft tyres? If he had new Softs, fair enough, those would have been better.

If he had new Supersofts, would he have had a chance to pass Rosberg? My guess is no.
They gave Hamilton used softs (7 laps old I think) and Nico's were brand new (or at worst 1 lap) super softs.

It's just all rather strange. Hamilton was the defacto leader. He was first and leading. Then Mercedes decided to pit Rosberg early (despite him already being in a good position) - probably in an attempt to get a 1 & 2. Fair enough. This offset both strategies. They kept Hamilton out, as to suggest he was on a 1-stop race. That is how Rosberg ended up with track position. Theoretically, the assumption was that Rosberg would pit towards the end and fall back again. Yet then they pitted both cars again - this time Hamilton first, but only to give him the worse tire. That really makes it seem that the team somehow wanted to give Rosberg an advantage. Technically, at the point Mercedes pitted both cars, Rosbergs was 11 laps older than Hamiltons. So they knew Hamiltons tire would last to the end on good pace. Yet they brought him him as well AND gave him the worse tire.

Then Hamilton, realising this, comes on the radio to question why Rosbegr is on the softer tire. :lol:

Seriously, this shunt and collision is very much Mercedes own fault.
You still haven't answered my question. Did Hamilton have any other tyres other than the Softs he ultimately used? If he had other options, I agree that those could/should have been used. If he had nothing else you're complaining about nothing.

Hamilton was on a 1-stop to counter Vettel. Vettel's tyre blew up and Hamilton's strategy was collateral damage as a result.

Pitting Hamilton a second time was probably unnecessary, but with 12-15 laps to go, if Rosberg had pitted and Hamilton stayed out, we could be having this discussion in reverse (Hamilton defending a fast charging Rosberg).

How can you keep talking about the Softs being the inferior tyre when this was patently not the case. Hamilton can question the decision, but as evidenced by the massive degradation on Rosberg's car, and many others, Soft tyres were far superior today. Hamilton is not a tyre expert, nor a strategist.

His team actually gave him the best tyres under the circumstances, and we wouldn't even be talking about the accident if Lewis hadn't locked a brake and his wheel gunner had been marginally quicker.

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siskue2005
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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GrizzleBoy
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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Diesel wrote:I don't see how Rosberg can be defended there. Hamilton was ahead in to the corner, Hamilton gave him lots of room, and he still decided to drive straight in to the side of Hamilton's car. Maybe he was just frustrated by the mistake he made in T1?
True.

You can't have someone drive into your sidepod if you aren't already in front of them.......

In many situations you'd call that a divebomb.

Fulcrum
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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NathanOlder wrote:
Fulcrum wrote:
Juzh wrote:Ted Kravitz is disgusting as foock with all this hamilton worshipping.
Being English is enough of an excuse to be a completely biased imbecile according to some members of this forum.
The Austrian track side announcers said it was Lewis' fault. Thats why he got all the booing. That biased enough for you?
Oh yes, that's incredibly biased.

And what does that have to do with Ted Kravitz might I ask?

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iotar__
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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Diesel wrote:I don't see how Rosberg can be defended there. Hamilton was ahead in to the corner, Hamilton gave him lots of room, and he still decided to drive straight in to the side of Hamilton's car. Maybe he was just frustrated by the mistake he made in T1?
- Maybe he was 'frustrated' because the only brainless person that goes by the name of Toto Wolff before the last stint with 1-2 used an undercut against the leading driver and put them on different tyres?
- Final lap blocking on top of car problems = worth trying. That's how Suzuka, USA '15 and Canada '16 could have ended. If those weren't problematic this one isn't either. Go off track to avoid collision, BTW how unlucky with this brake by wire problem, I hope Mercedes will again squash conspiracy theories with some letters.

- When in Spain Hamilton crashes into Rosberg and loses them 43 points, afformantioned Wolff announces that it's great that they let them race. When it's 1-2 he himself loses into 1-4 he's furious about "defending that was too hard" and 'brainless collision'?
- Wolff should have used team orders like in Monaco (Merc policy not mine - Rosberg was quicker here) or at least given some buttons puzzle to solve, it would be enough to occupy al least one of them long enough ;-)

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DiogoBrand
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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Seriously guys, unlike Spain, there's no shadow of doubt that the blame is on Rosberg. The guy "understeered" so badly that even being on the inside he came out of the corner on the exit kerb, going nowhere near the apex of the corner.
The only reason for someone to defend him is that it all ended up turning against him, so he gets the "piety points".

Alguck
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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wesley123 wrote:
Pierce89 wrote:
wesley123 wrote: Seriously? How long did he need to wait until he could turn in, until he was in America?
No, not America. Just wait till there's not a car sitting there, where he turns.
Which is why Hamilton turned in much, much later to begin with.
And still not late enough. How can you defend him stating the fact that he turned in *later* than he normally would have?
He still needlessly ran into another car. They were side by side, he was not even in front.

We see overtakes taking place in u-turns like in Canada where the car on the outside almost has to stop because there is no space due to the car on the inside, but exactly that (going very slow and waiting for the other car to leave the turn) is one of the other options. It's perfectly valid to force such an option onto another driver, we're racing here.

@GrizzleBoy Where did anyone run into anyone's sidepod? :shock:

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Phil
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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Fulcrum wrote:You still haven't answered my question. Did Hamilton have any other tyres other than the Softs he ultimately used?
I'm assuming they should have each had sets that are similar, given they both had the same qualifying, equal runs on equal tires. And it still doesn't explain why they pitted both cars, if they knew that one car that needed to pit had already done 11 laps more and was still going well to consider not pitting the other (HAM).
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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Re: 2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

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NathanOlder wrote:
Fulcrum wrote:
Juzh wrote:Ted Kravitz is disgusting as foock with all this hamilton worshipping.
Being English is enough of an excuse to be a completely biased imbecile according to some members of this forum.
Are you British ? If not, why are you watching Ted ?
Because anybody that speaks English is generally forced to listen to Sky.