2016 British Grand Prix - Silverstone, 08-10 July

[Shooty81]

The first part was ok:

Rosberg: "Gearbox problem."
Merc:: "Driver default 1-0-1, chassis default 0-1, chassis default 0-1. Avoid seventh gear, Nico, avoid seventh gear."
Rosberg: "What does that mean, I have to shift through it?"


Problem was the advice to shift through 7th gear:

Merc: "A-firm Nico, you need to shift through it. A-firm you need to shift through it."

As he could have finished the race also without the 7th and 8th gear.

[FoxHound]

Is this really what we all want?
!

Again, he was penalized, because he asked a question of how to work around a future issue, that the team told him.

So requesting this information regarding the reliability issue is against the rules?
Dan, how would you feel if this happened to Hamilton, and bearing in mind his engine allowances, it could very well happen....

[F1PuertoRico]

Interesting that Hamilton got the silent treatment when he had problems with the car in Baku.

[FoxHound]

The first part was ok:

Rosberg: "Gearbox problem."
Merc:: "Driver default 1-0-1, chassis default 0-1, chassis default 0-1. Avoid seventh gear, Nico, avoid seventh gear."
Rosberg: "What does that mean, I have to shift through it?"


Problem was the advice to shift through 7th gear:

Merc: "A-firm Nico, you need to shift through it. A-firm you need to shift through it."

As he could have finished the race also without the 7th and 8th gear.

He did not know that, and....had he used 7th, are you guaranteeing that he would finish?

[dans79]

The first part was ok:

Rosberg: "Gearbox problem."
Merc:: "Driver default 1-0-1, chassis default 0-1, chassis default 0-1. Avoid seventh gear, Nico, avoid seventh gear."
Rosberg: "What does that mean, I have to shift through it?"


Problem was the advice to shift through 7th gear:

Merc: "A-firm Nico, you need to shift through it. A-firm you need to shift through it."

As he could have finished the race also without the 7th and 8th gear.

exactly right!!

[GrizzleBoy]

Ive seen on one website that Merc are going to appeal http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merce ... ty-797656/

[dans79]

He did not know that, and....had he used 7th, are you guaranteeing that he would finish?

That doesn't matter, fixing a problem and being told how to fix potential future ones are completely different.

[Restomaniac]

So Merc feel it's ok to tell Rosberg how to change gear instead of retiring.
Yet in the last race they stated they couldn't tell that same driver that his brakes were critical and that he had a BBW failure?
Then we have the fact that they said couldn't tell Hamilton about his problems in Bacu.

BS of the highest order.

Well, you've got BS and BS.

For the BBW in Austria, you don't, never criticise a team member in public, these day's not even Niki. Of course, when I driver goes long, his brakes etc etc, or his tires etc etc, tried to maximise the situation, electronic bladiebla.

For Hamilton in Baku, that was a performance issue. Not a part failing. He needed to operate the car...
For Rosberg, two things he got: how to reset the gearbox, else he would have DNF-ed (this should be allowed) and a second message how he should shift from 6 to 8. Which you don't need to finish the race with only a handful laps.

Thats exactly the point I'm making.
We can't tell Rosberg he has a BBW failure (It was clear he didn't IMHO) but we can tell him he has a gearbox failure.
We can't tell Hamilton how to fix an engine problem but we can tell Rosberg how to fix a gearbox problem.

Like I said BS of the highest order. Merc and now so untrustworthy it's beyond belief.

[Jolle]

Fun fact, in 2014 the WC after the British GP was:

Ros: 165
Ham: 161

Now:
Ros: 168
Ham: 167 (would have been four points as well if there was no penalty)

And in 2014 the BGP was the ninth GP of the season, in 2016 the tenth.

[Restomaniac]

So Merc feel it's ok to tell Rosberg how to change gear instead of retiring.
Yet in the last race they stated they couldn't tell that same driver that his brakes were critical and that he had a BBW failure?
Then we have the fact that they said couldn't tell Hamilton about his problems in Bacu.

BS of the highest order.

As I said in the last race thread, Merc management are so far past being trustworthy its unreal. Its impossible to believe a single word they say.

Agreed.
If the Merc management told me that grass is green I'd go and check.

[stuartpengs]

Agree with all of the above, with the exception of the penalty. If he hadn't been told what mode to go to and then how to workaround the issue I'm pretty sure he would have finished much lower down. Rules and rules, he should have been DSQ.

That's not relevant though. The penalties are applied for the infringement, not the thousands of possible permutations that can/might/could have resulted from the infringement

Having considered the matter extensively, the stewards determined the team gave some instructions to the driver that were specifically permitted under technical directive 014-16.

"However, the stewards determined the team then went further and gave instructions to the driver that were not permitted under the technical directive, and were in breach of article 27.1 of the sporting regulations, that the driver must drive the car alone and unaided"

The instruction to change the mode was permitted, the instruction not to use 7th gear wasn't. The fact that he did use 7th gear after that instruction specifically undermines your argument that the instruction directly prevented a failure.

Come on guys, let's try to remain objective here. The main driving force for the baying for blood is because it was Rosberg. It's getting silly in here.

[iotar__]

- 10 s? Fine by me. Pushing driver off (Vettel) - 5 s. Crashing into team-mate and taking both out - no penalties but 7 points gained but broken car through no fault of your own is quickly punished. OK.
- car problems in another race and incompetent team - time for Mercedes to write letters about Rosberg's lack of luck.
- Let's say SC happens it'd better for Rosberg to crash into Hamilton attempting stupid move instead of fixing his gear-box
- Horner "radio rules are rubbish"? They are considerably less rubbish than collision rules, track limits rules and driving in an unsafe manner rules that are ignored all the time. The former are seldom/never broken. Let's not forget unsafe release rubbish rules in case of Ricciardo.

[jknights]

Hmmmmm. Not sure that this will improve the situation with respect to a clarification as to what may or may not be said.
I think it needs to be only:
Return to Pit
Stop Car

Anything else can/might be a coded instruction.

However I think that ROS will feel somewhat hard done by in this situation.
In all fairness the pit wall should have said nothing or did what they did to HAM when they were both having mode issues.

[turbof1]

So let's go over this. this is the full transcript:
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/radio ... ue-797513/

Rosberg: “Gearbox problem.”

Engineer: “Driver default 1-0-1, chassis default 0-1, chassis default 0-1.”

Engineer: “Avoid seventh gear, Nico, avoid seventh gear.”

Rosberg: “What does that mean, I have to shift through it?”

Engineer: “Affirm Nico, you need to shift through it. Affirm, you need to shift through it.”

The first 2 messages towards Nico were ok as they were no instructions how to drive, but instructions how to keep the car from breaking down, which is in line with technical directive 014-16 (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.ph ... les-breach).

However, when Nico asked if he had to shift through it, the following reply was considered driving aid.

In my view, it's very tough call. You could make a case for both standpoints. There are going to be more of such cases in the near future: you are allowed to give messages to keep the car from breaking down, but anything that arguably can be described as instruction how to drive the car is going to result in a penalty. That's a very vague line.

[smellybeard]

Interesting that Hamilton got the silent treatment when he had problems with the car in Baku.

To be fair, Hammy is no dope and he doesn't need the hand holding that his team mate seems to need to have a stab at the championship.