2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
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djos
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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FoxHound wrote:
Webber2011 wrote:I must say I applaud your memory, (or more to the point your painstaking research :wink: )

Being a Webber tragic myself, I look back on those years with all sorts of horrible things floating around in my head.
I honestly, and quite possibly wrongly, thought RBR suffered Renault related problems far more often.

Would your figures be different if Webber's retirements, and race ruining failures were included ?

I have no idea, and wouldn't know where to look to find accurate details ?
Wikipedia is my friend, and to an extent, F1Fanatic is a valuable reference point. It's really easily collated and I type real quick... 8)

The overall reliability figures would be different as just from a general obs over the stats, Webber had more issues.
From skimming through the 2010-2014 years, Vettel had 7 DNF's to Webbers 10.
Iirc Webber had a lot of ers issues in qually too.
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.

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Paul
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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Weren't they running in-house KERS?

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turbof1
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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Yes, they were.:
https://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2012/04/ ... apacitors/

Also mind it's best not to only take RBR engine fails into account, but also from other teams. Red Bull was notorious for cramping the engine in what basically were alternate pocket dimensions.

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Oh awesome! That's a very nice carpet to excercise my yoga on... Wait where's the obnoxious sound coming from?
#AeroFrodo

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FoxHound
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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Paul wrote:Weren't they running in-house KERS?
I think i mentioned this in my post, but Turbo kindly posted the link. It was a Red Bull system.


I haven't the time at the moment to sift through 4 years qualy data, as its harder to validate(why they qualifed lower).
But I'm sure a resourceful and motivated reader can source this if the desire to further the evidence of dispelling the Renault 'unreliability' myth is there.


But for issues pertaining to KERS in qualifying, it will have even more profound implications on Red Bull's reliability vs that of Renault.

I think the issue is that historically, alot of people would put down any technical failure as Renault derived.

As we see, simply not the case.
JET set

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turbof1
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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Renault had a very well designed V8 which originated from a very well designed V10. I think they had that very much covered. Perhaps in 2007 and 2008 they had some issues, but those got ironed out.

The last 2 years were a bigger issue. Of course it does not help if you are bound to just a handful of engines a year and very limited testing on circuit. Though they should have done a better job in 2015. They did learned from it, and this year they are on par with reliability. Perhaps even a bit more reliable than Ferrari and Mercedes, who had some issues in the first half of the season.
#AeroFrodo

lio007
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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Brilliant ... fair and square racing:
https://streamable.com/yreo

Sonador
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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lio007 wrote:Brilliant ... fair and square racing:
https://streamable.com/yreo
There is respect between those two.

Verstappen was the quicker driver today, but Ricciardo absolutely deserved this win!
He had so much bad luck, he was due to some good luck.

Awesome and touching that he dedicated the win to Jules Bianchi!

Good racing =D>

lio007
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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And also credits to Renault! They have done an amazing job this year with the PU!

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djos
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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lio007 wrote:Brilliant ... fair and square racing:
https://streamable.com/yreo
Indeed, and great to see the respect and camaraderie between them after they parked their cars too!

It's pretty clear the RedBull have arguably the best driver pairing on the grid. 8)
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.

Mansell89
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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Didn't want to post this on the engine thread as that's more of a specific technical discussion, but at what point does Red Bull suffer the same fate as the Mercedes customer teams?

As Renault works team continues its rebuild and renaissance over the next two years, there has to come a point where Red Bull are no longer a dominant recipient of the fruits of that engine development.

Are we all certain that Red Bull is actively looking to switch to a new entrant (VW/BMW) or will they explore alternatives?

It's a pressing question for me because with Newey at their disposal, they are likely to have a very good chassis again and an engine anywhere close to par with the field benchmark puts them bang there in 2017.

If the engine isn't up to it though, we know how quickly things can change with the impatience of RBR and their owner.

It's vastly important to the careers of Dan Ricc and Max too- this is huge for Red Bull and when you look across at McLaren, Ron Dennis has bet the mortgage that you need to be a works team to be winning in this formula...

Fascinating to see how it pans out.

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turbof1
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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Mansell89 wrote:Didn't want to post this on the engine thread as that's more of a specific technical discussion, but at what point does Red Bull suffer the same fate as the Mercedes customer teams?

As Renault works team continues its rebuild and renaissance over the next two years, there has to come a point where Red Bull are no longer a dominant recipient of the fruits of that engine development.

Are we all certain that Red Bull is actively looking to switch to a new entrant (VW/BMW) or will they explore alternatives?
That is very difficult to tell. In all honesty I see the Renault struggling for a longer period then just 2 years. They lack structure, expertise and leadership for the moment concerning the chassis side of things.

Furthermore, within a couple of years the amount of PUs might be further reduced to just 3 allocations a season. So you are not as much left out on updates since you can only have updates on 3 occasions during the season (without taking a penalty). At worst Red Bull would have to wait 1 or 2 races longer before receiving the update.
#AeroFrodo

hemichromis
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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Mansell89 wrote:Didn't want to post this on the engine thread as that's more of a specific technical discussion, but at what point does Red Bull suffer the same fate as the Mercedes customer teams?

As Renault works team continues its rebuild and renaissance over the next two years, there has to come a point where Red Bull are no longer a dominant recipient of the fruits of that engine development.

Are we all certain that Red Bull is actively looking to switch to a new entrant (VW/BMW) or will they explore alternatives?

It's a pressing question for me because with Newey at their disposal, they are likely to have a very good chassis again and an engine anywhere close to par with the field benchmark puts them bang there in 2017.

If the engine isn't up to it though, we know how quickly things can change with the impatience of RBR and their owner.

It's vastly important to the careers of Dan Ricc and Max too- this is huge for Red Bull and when you look across at McLaren, Ron Dennis has bet the mortgage that you need to be a works team to be winning in this formula...

Fascinating to see how it pans out.
With Mercedes, even if they do provide an equal power unit the customer teams will still be far adrift.

With Renault, it feels almost impossible that they could design a better car than Red bull with a similar budget.
I expect this is why Mercedes would rather not give Red bull an engine!

I expect Red bulls only option when Renault become a contender and starts giving them customer engines would be to approach Honda. If in 2 years Mclaren has failed to move to the front i'd expect Ron Dennis' veto would matter little!

basti313
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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F1NAC
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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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As a Ferrari fan this was my pose for majority of the race

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Re: 2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

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http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/red-b ... ay-844168/

This article seems to frame the deal as a good move by RB - and perhaps commercially it is, I don't know the details - but competitively is it good idea to go with a different fuels partner than your engine supplier? One who has been working on a completely different manufacturer PU?

Wondering if they'll suffer some pain for this in the early stages of the relationship at least.