2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

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siskue2005
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by siskue2005 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:22 am

zibby43 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:09 am
siskue2005 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 5:22 am
zibby43 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:31 am

And Mercedes started last year with the advantage Ferrari has *this* year.
Vettel had 3 poles out of the first 4 races in 2018
and won 2 of them, and could have easily won all 4 (team screw up in China and Him screwing up in Baku)
Except for Spain/France (with special tyres) they were the fastest car until Singapore GP

i think they are on a similar position in 2019 also....the Ferrari was also the better in 2018 initially, after the summer break Ferrari dirver and team usually fall apart.

If we had similar situations to 2018 then we are on for a great season
The difference to 2018 season and now is that back then Mercedes were very close behind Ferrari in most races....but i have doubts this season.
Mercedes supposedly had a sizeable margin over Ferrari to begin the season last year. While that margin did secure Hamilton a dominant pole in Melbourne, Mercedes lost the race (strategy software error) after Hamilton put a significant gap on Vettel.

Mercedes did not win until Azerbaijan.

Ferrari did bring a massive floor update to Bahrain, last year, however.
Mercedes didn't win Baku, it was Ferrari/Vettel who lost it, otherwise, it was an easy win for them.

moreover, are you suggesting the Bahrain floor update from Ferrari was worth nearly one second (comparison of pole laps from Melbourne and Bahrain)? Dont think it works like that.

You need to understand the Melbourne track is a special one, it usually is not representative of the pecking order.

waynes
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by waynes » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:06 am

stumbled across this on a forum i'm on. Anyone heard similar? certainly would explain why Wolff and Allison dont sound too keen

Image

obviously I havent seen anything mentioned on here about cooling issues

siskue2005
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by siskue2005 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:21 am

waynes wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:06 am
stumbled across this on a forum i'm on. Anyone heard similar? certainly would explain why Wolff and Allison dont sound too keen

https://i.imgur.com/8QQPfkt.png

obviously I havent seen anything mentioned on here about cooling issues
is this autosport form?
dont believe everything on the internet 8)
There are a lot of people with friends or cousins etc working in F1 :lol:

waynes
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by waynes » Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:24 am

siskue2005 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:21 am
is this autosport form?
dont believe everything on the internet 8)
There are a lot of people with friends or cousins etc working in F1 :lol:
:lol:

Whilst i dont tend to believe everything on the internet, it seemed to (loosely) tie in with what i'd read on here. As you say, everyone has all got family and friends working in F1 (my mate is Vettels seat washer by the way)

guess we might hear more about any potential issues this weekend :)

GrandAxe
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by GrandAxe » Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:48 am

waynes wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:06 am
stumbled across this on a forum i'm on. Anyone heard similar? certainly would explain why Wolff and Allison dont sound too keen

https://i.imgur.com/8QQPfkt.png

obviously I havent seen anything mentioned on here about cooling issues
Mercs only real problems during testing came from tyres and aero. Cooling seems to be a pretty long shot.

Partymood
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Partymood » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:57 pm

GrandAxe wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:48 am
waynes wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:06 am
stumbled across this on a forum i'm on. Anyone heard similar? certainly would explain why Wolff and Allison dont sound too keen

https://i.imgur.com/8QQPfkt.png

obviously I havent seen anything mentioned on here about cooling issues
Mercs only real problems during testing came from tyres and aero. Cooling seems to be a pretty long shot.
It can be argued that aero and cooling requirements are closely related. Just think about a short blanket.

GPR -A
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by GPR -A » Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:14 pm

GrandAxe wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:48 am
waynes wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:06 am
stumbled across this on a forum i'm on. Anyone heard similar? certainly would explain why Wolff and Allison dont sound too keen

https://i.imgur.com/8QQPfkt.png

obviously I havent seen anything mentioned on here about cooling issues
Mercs only real problems during testing came from tyres and aero. Cooling seems to be a pretty long shot.
I am curious, why do you say they have aero issues?

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Just_a_fan » Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:41 pm

siskue2005 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:22 am

Mercedes didn't win Baku, it was Ferrari/Vettel who lost it, otherwise, it was an easy win for them.
Baku was Mercedes' first win last year, that was the point he was making. One could argue that Mercedes lost Oz, Ferrari didn't win it, applying your logic.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

Phil
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Phil » Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:52 pm

Maybe not, if Hamiltons pole lap was an anomaly, combination being Hamilton plus unrepresentative street track...
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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mkay
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by mkay » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:06 pm

GPR -A wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:14 pm
GrandAxe wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:48 am
waynes wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:06 am
stumbled across this on a forum i'm on. Anyone heard similar? certainly would explain why Wolff and Allison dont sound too keen

https://i.imgur.com/8QQPfkt.png

obviously I havent seen anything mentioned on here about cooling issues
Mercs only real problems during testing came from tyres and aero. Cooling seems to be a pretty long shot.
I am curious, why do you say they have aero issues?
It's been widely reported that Merc has rear downforce issues at the moment.

GPR -A
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by GPR -A » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:24 pm

mkay wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:06 pm
GPR -A wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:14 pm
GrandAxe wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:48 am


Mercs only real problems during testing came from tyres and aero. Cooling seems to be a pretty long shot.
I am curious, why do you say they have aero issues?
It's been widely reported that Merc has rear downforce issues at the moment.
Source please.

https://thejudge13.com/2019/02/28/is-th ... onditions/
Mercedes seem to not enjoy the new Pirelli compounds with very heavy graining, even at times of the day when the so-called “cold graining” shouldn’t be a problem. Mercedes admit that they “also experienced it in the warm afternoon hours.” claim AMuS.

Other teams also have problems with the fact that the Pirelli surface peels off, but mostly limited to the cool morning hours, the so-called ‘cold graining’ phenomena. But graining can also be a consequence of too much slipping on the asphalt, pointing toward poor aero, but Mercedes technicians rule this out: “We certainly don’t have too little downforce.

“For a fast lap, 10 o’clock is our best time. For longruns from 12 to 14 o’clock. Unfortunately one hour of it is lunch break.” admit the pit wall to AMuS.

Pirelli offers new rubber compounds this year, a reaction to the thinner surface.

“The tyres behave very differently than last year,” complain many of the team engineers. And that makes it so difficult to read the lap times. Also, long-runs are tricky to read.

PhillipM
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by PhillipM » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:48 pm

Graining can just be about too much load through a cold tyre rather than slippage, it could well be the case that the Merc was generating more df than anyone else causing the graining.

mkay
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by mkay » Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:31 pm

GPR -A wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:24 pm
mkay wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:06 pm
GPR -A wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:14 pm
I am curious, why do you say they have aero issues?
It's been widely reported that Merc has rear downforce issues at the moment.
Source please.

https://thejudge13.com/2019/02/28/is-th ... onditions/
Mercedes seem to not enjoy the new Pirelli compounds with very heavy graining, even at times of the day when the so-called “cold graining” shouldn’t be a problem. Mercedes admit that they “also experienced it in the warm afternoon hours.” claim AMuS.

Other teams also have problems with the fact that the Pirelli surface peels off, but mostly limited to the cool morning hours, the so-called ‘cold graining’ phenomena. But graining can also be a consequence of too much slipping on the asphalt, pointing toward poor aero, but Mercedes technicians rule this out: “We certainly don’t have too little downforce.

“For a fast lap, 10 o’clock is our best time. For longruns from 12 to 14 o’clock. Unfortunately one hour of it is lunch break.” admit the pit wall to AMuS.

Pirelli offers new rubber compounds this year, a reaction to the thinner surface.

“The tyres behave very differently than last year,” complain many of the team engineers. And that makes it so difficult to read the lap times. Also, long-runs are tricky to read.
I believe this was during the first week. The new aero package claimed to have fixed the aero inbalance per AMuS, but the graining remains.

Merc engineers may say the W10 doesn't have "too little" downforce - which is fair, perhaps - but Ferrari has been the best car over testing on medium and high speed corners and also the most stable under heavy breaking, all signs pointing to it having loads of downforce.

dans79
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by dans79 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:03 pm

mkay wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:31 pm
Merc engineers may say the W10 doesn't have "too little" downforce - which is fair, perhaps - but Ferrari has been the best car over testing on medium and high speed corners and also the most stable under heavy breaking, all signs pointing to it having loads of downforce.
Stability has nothing to do with the amount of down force. Stability is related to the mechanical and aero balance of the car.

GPR -A
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by GPR -A » Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:06 pm

mkay wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:31 pm
Merc engineers may say the W10 doesn't have "too little" downforce - which is fair, perhaps - but Ferrari has been the best car over testing on medium and high speed corners and also the most stable under heavy breaking, all signs pointing to it having loads of downforce.
If your point is to prove that, Ferrari is a better car than Mercedes, then you are free to believe so. But if the idea is to understand the issues with Mercedes, then you need to have an independent approach towards the issues. With that, if a car is having tyre warming issues and the tyres are not in right working window, the car is going to naturally have problems in the cornering performance.