2016 Belgian Grand Prix - Fri 26 – Sun 28 Aug 2016

[foxmulder_ms]

For the 1st corner I blame Vettel more than Vestapen. Raikkonen has absolutely zero fault. If Vettel was not trying to cut Raikkonen that wouldnt happened.

[Fifty]

I am pretty sure that if I did a PlayStation dive into the inside like VER did, but made the pass successfully, with my right wheels full off curb and my left wheels hovering white line and entering the green curb area, I should receive a 5 second penalty for overtaking off course like NASR received.

No one has really mounted that portion of VER drive into the corner. He violated track limits.

His other blocking moments were atrocious. He needs a punch in the face.
These are the things the older drivers were talking about when they started promoting teenagers that barely won a few GP2 races and at most on Gp2 championship.
Everyone can be quick if they're stupid.

[dans79]

Everyone can be quick if they're stupid.

This kinds of reminds me of what NASCAR people would say about rookies in the 90's. "They're all reckless & brazen till they have a major accident."

[GPR-A duplicate2]

I don't understand the fuss about Verstappen's racing skills here. Legends like Senna and Schumacher also did a great deal of hard racing, Vettel was a crash kid too (doing it again this year), Lewis had a bad year in 2011, but they all are great champions. So would be Max and he isn't doing anything any of those great champions didn't do. Stop cribbing and move on guys.

Max and Kimi are Lewis and Massa of 2011. Invariably they come together due to some magnetic attraction. I guess that would change with Ferrari going backwards next year.

[dans79]

I don't understand the fuss about Verstappen's racing skills here. Legends like Senna and Schumacher also did a great deal of hard racing, Vettel was a crash kid too (doing it again this year), Lewis had a bad year in 2011, but they all are great champions. So would be Max and he isn't doing anything any of those great champions didn't do. Stop cribbing and move on guys.

Max and Kimi are Lewis and Massa of 2011. Invariably they come together due to some magnetic attraction. I guess that would change with Ferrari going backwards next year.

There is a big difference between being a hard racer, being accident prone, and what Max is, "dangerous to everyone around him". If he keeps on the way he is, it's only a matter of time before he seriously injures himself or someone else.

Most likely the accident will be something very similar to Webber in Valencia.

[Fulcrum]

I don't understand the fuss about Verstappen's racing skills here. Legends like Senna and Schumacher also did a great deal of hard racing, Vettel was a crash kid too (doing it again this year), Lewis had a bad year in 2011, but they all are great champions. So would be Max and he isn't doing anything any of those great champions didn't do. Stop cribbing and move on guys.

Max and Kimi are Lewis and Massa of 2011. Invariably they come together due to some magnetic attraction. I guess that would change with Ferrari going backwards next year.

Senna drove in another era. The world has moved on since his day, and I have little doubt some of his behaviour on track would have been more critically appraised today.

'Greatness' doesn't give you license to play by your own rules. Furthermore, Verstappen hasn't achieved any real measure of 'greatness' relative to the names you mention - including Massa.

[GPR-A duplicate2]

'Greatness' doesn't give you license to play by your own rules. Furthermore, Verstappen hasn't achieved any real measure of 'greatness' relative to the names you mention - including Massa.

When Senna or Schumacher were involved in hard racing, neither were they GREAT yet. If they wouldn't have achieved the results, they would have been called "YESTERYEARS' MALDONADOS". But they had the same attitude to racing that Max has, if Max doesn't achieve the results in future, then he would be just that, ANOTHER MALDONADO. But if he indeed goes on to achieve championships, no one will remember what happened this year or may be next. But one thing is for certain, if he shuts those aggressive racing instincts at this stage of his career, he would be a miserable failure. He knows that.

[wickedz50]

'Greatness' doesn't give you license to play by your own rules. Furthermore, Verstappen hasn't achieved any real measure of 'greatness' relative to the names you mention - including Massa.

When Senna or Schumacher were involved in hard racing, neither were they GREAT yet. If they wouldn't have achieved the results, they would have been called "YESTERYEARS' MALDONADOS". But they had the same attitude to racing that Max has, if Max doesn't achieve the results in future, then he would be just that, ANOTHER MALDONADO. But if he indeed goes on to achieve championships, no one will remember what happened this year or may be next. But one thing is for certain, if he shuts those aggressive racing instincts at this stage of his career, he would be a miserable failure. He knows that.

I agree to the extent that he will be a great with these skills if he can win championship and become a great champion in future. Racing in the past has been dirty most of the time with less regulations then. Max today is taking too much risk and there can be a pitfall to his confidence down the line if these skills are penalized.
Honestly you will agree that this car is not yet the championship winning car. Hence I will expect Max to not expose his aggressive driving as yet. It will be more than handful to use these natural skills when the RBR is a championship winning car. Max's skills are very unique and does take each and every racer on the track by surprise.
Will love to see Max vs Lewis in a straight championship fight with equal machinery.

[GPR-A duplicate2]

Will love to see Max vs Lewis in a straight championship fight with equal machinery.

We have seen enough of Lewis, Vettel and Alonso. I would like to see Sainz Vs Max Vs Ocon Vs Stoffel, but definitely with way more aggressive attitude and a bit of leniency in judging racing skills, rather than Grandma approach to racing that it is today and people crying about safety.

Honestly, we love racing because it involves risk and danger at great speeds, otherwise, what's the difference in driving in city traffic, following rules and racing. We would need strong and aggressive characters on and off the track. Today, it has become too much of a gentleman's sport. If someone starts racing career, thinking of retiring safe and peaceful and have wonderful grand children, they must be kidding. Well may be not, as people here are demanding discipline of the level of an elementary school kid.

[dans79]

I would like to see Sainz Vs Max Vs Ocon Vs Stoffel, but definitely with way more aggressive attitude and a bit of leniency in judging racing skills, rather than Grandma approach to racing that it

You're a millennial aren't you?

Honestly, we love racing because it involves risk and danger at great speeds, otherwise, what's the difference in driving in city traffic, following rules and racing.

The risks the drivers take with their own lives, not others.

Like the Villeneuve & Zonta dare.

[turbof1]

...he did NOT divebomb into the corner

Verstappen knows what he did; he just thinks it's acceptable...

“The start wasn’t great,” Verstappen told reporters after the race. “I dived up in the inside and locked a wheel so I was easily making the corner but they just kept squeezing me.”

It's textbook divebombing if a driver's velocity at corner entry is such that he cannot maintain complete control of his car.

Arriving at the corner ≠ making the corner.

EDIT:

http://i.imgur.com/vlI7sUh.jpg
Romain Grosjean arrives at La Source ahead of Fernando Alonso

Ben, I hate to make this a matter of symantics, but I there is a difference between diving into a hole (as in taking a certain open line to overtake in a corner) and divebombing into a hole (the same as above, but braking too late without a chance to make it stick into the corner).

As Verstappen said himself, he did lock up, and turned into the corner. He was able to, as you can notice from these frames:






I also refuse to draw any comparison between this, and Grosjean's 'action' in 2012. Aside the same corner, these 2 incidents have nothing in common.

[nevill3]

A typical first corner incident, Kimi would have seen Max on the inside and would normally have given him room but was unable to due to Vettel being on the outside and cutting in quite aggressively to take the corner ahead of him. No ones at fault hence no penalties, Vettel could have gone wider but saw a chance to get ahead of Kimi, Max saw the gap and was alongside Kimi before the corner, Kimi was the only one with no options and was a passive victim in this.

[Moanlower]

To me, it's so clear that it's even funny watching the pages of pro's and cons. Vettel and kimi is NOT to blame, they took a normal racing line where only retards would even try to dive into that gap in the braking zone, going off track practically. Then he feel's mistreated and revenged on Kimi in a dangerous way and pushed him off track deliberately. Racing such idiots that think they have the right to do and go wheverever they want at any time is something you want to avoid at all times like the plague. Pardon my french, but this respectless kiddo needs to feel a fist in the face before he comes to senses.

[turbof1]

A typical first corner incident, Kimi would have seen Max on the inside and would normally have given him room but was unable to due to Vettel being on the outside and cutting in quite aggressively to take the corner ahead of him. No ones at fault hence no penalties, Vettel could have gone wider but saw a chance to get ahead of Kimi, Max saw the gap and was alongside Kimi before the corner, Kimi was the only one with no options and was a passive victim in this.

Exactly. Kimi is known for a very high spatial awareness. It is just he had nowhere to go. I think he realised how this went quite early and was hoping for a mild outcome. I also feel that Verstappen is wrong to put his anger and frustration on Kimi later in the race.

[sosic2121]

Rejoice people, Pastor Maldonado is back! It's a bit strange to see him in a Red Bull, however

only difference is that Maldonado earned his win in Spain. lol