Fernando Alonso proved a happy man after Sunday's Belgian Grand Prix. The Spaniard finished 7th, having progressed through the field, before holding off competitors that would otherwise expected to be much quicker than the McLaren Honda package.
sosic2121 wrote:while first corner was 100% racing incident, verstapen should have known that he has less than 50% chance to keep his front wing, and yet he made his move.
That's not skill, that's being reckless and having no respect for the team. Well, if he earned his place, he would respect it a lot more.
Almost every race he makes some stupid move, and yet only thing we hear about are his "skills".
If you want to see rookie with skills and potential to become truly great, take a look at Vandoorn during his FIRST race. Such shame his daddy isn't able to get him a seat.
Vandoorn
GP2 champion in a field of allmost none talent drivers.
I love Verstappen drive style. Best in years! No sleeping robot driver. Please pass me with DRS seems to be normal these days
I too love many things about verstapen.
I love how he pits when he likes and then hits his team mate for no reason, I love how he illegally overtakes his team mates, I love his crashes per day ratio in Monaco and I love the treatment he started to getting from other drivers.
turbof1 wrote:However, since Vettel hit Raikkonen before Verstappen lost momentum or went wide, I feel that's atleast partly void. What if Verstappen was not there, would Vettel have pushed Raikkonen into the wall?
No, as the close up picture show Vettel and Kimi would have no problem taking the corner. There was more than enough space underneath Vettel for one car, but not for 2.
Last edited by LionKing on 29 Aug 2016, 17:25, edited 1 time in total.
sosic2121 wrote:
I too love many things about verstapen.
I love how he pits when he likes and then hits his team mate for no reason, I love how he illegally overtakes his team mates, I love his crashes per day ratio in Monaco and I love the treatment he started to getting from other drivers.
Don't forget the child like tirades over the radio!
First corner incident was a racing incident but could have been avoided by Verstappen only since he´s the only guy that can actually do something about it.
Kimi is pinned and Vettel can´t possibly know Verstappen snuck up on the inside.
If Verstappen is mad he should be mad at himself.
It wasn´t a divebomb either since he was half alongside well before turn-in.
A divebomb happens when you´re arriving on the inside after the guy on the outside has started turning.
The real issue for me is what he does on the straights. He either moves several times or he moves after the guy behind has committed.
Its just a matter of time before someone "accidentally" have their front wing touch one of his rear wheels.
You know you´re doing a mighty fine job when your moves are frowned upon in the motorsport with the least regard to ethics in wheel to wheel racing....
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"
I have to admit, i was more surprised by Vettel's move than Max's move, he tried to cut Kimi REALLY bad and it's his teammate for god's sake AND it's the first corner at spa... that's almost asking for trouble.
It looked that there was quite a lot of space for Max next to Kimi until he got squeezed (relatively speaking).
If Max and Kimi were alone, nothing would have happened, if Vettel and Kimi were alone , nothing would have happened but unfortunately there were three of them ...
Does anyone have a compilation of dangerous moves by Max at this race (or in general, would be interesting to see) ?
Verstappen Dive-bombed into the corner.
So did the Force India following close behind.
Vettel cut in too deep onto Kimi.
I personally think Verstappen judged the divebomb just right. He could have made the corner without hitting kimi. Vettel on the other hand misjudged his turn in point. He took the corner as if no cars were at the apex. It is not the first time we see Vettel cut off people like this at turn one. He wasn't fully aware of the traffic at the apex. So,I think it is Vettel's fault, but it is an honest mistake.
In find Vettels reaction a little strange. Clearly he knows the corner like his backpocket and chose a line, which would leave just enough space for one car (Kimi) on the inside. This would mean he was turning in sharp and Kimi had to steer away to the inside to prevent a crash anyway. So if Max wasn't there, both Ferrari's would have made it, but Kimi still had to evade Sebastian's sharp turn in.
NL_Fer wrote:In find Vettels reaction a little strange. Clearly he knows the corner like his backpocket and chose a line, which would leave just enough space for one car (Kimi) on the inside. This would mean he was turning in sharp and Kimi had to steer away to the inside to prevent a crash anyway. So if Max wasn't there, both Ferrari's would have made it, but Kimi still had to evade Sebastian's sharp turn in.
I am big Ferrari and Kimi fan, and my first reaction was Seb WTF have you done. But now I'm little disappointed by Kimi not closing the door. He knew who was behind and what he will do. This was his chance to shine
Fifty wrote:And yet no one is mentioning his corner fly off at eau rouge and two more corners... Because of an "end plate"...
It is simply this: Under pressure Max drives extremely dangerous. Under pressure his talent limit drops and he then tries to drive even faster. The problem is normal speed under pressure is already above his limit. He is too immature emotionally to realize this and practice stress inoculation. He continues on in his PlayStation driving which causes him to be out of control. This is an extreme danger to the other drivers.
He needs a time out. He will reconsider and come back a much better driver. Even Kvyat is driving better after the break once he figured out what his slap was for.
Good racers are always looking for the limit, great racers remember where they are.
I would give it some time to see how he developes.
I mean how many people have written off Schumacher after he tangled with Senna in Spa and with Mansell in Adelaide. Or Vettel and Kubica first getting together and then crashing trying to race a broken car to the pits in Adelaide (?) Or Hamilton crashing in China trying to set a new pit entry record with one canvas wheel.
There is a reason we have a wall of champions in Canada.
Even Sainz who we all laude for his levelheadedness came pretty close to having a really bad crash when he tried how fast he could take les combes on three wheels.
Maybe these things are becoming more common now because in the past driver would mature in lower series and then come to F1, now its becoming more and more a junior series.
Last edited by Edax on 29 Aug 2016, 20:46, edited 1 time in total.
As for Max, i think he's the biggest sensation in F1 and he's on fire and doing what F1's all about: no-compromise racing.
Schumacher did that, Senna did that, Piquet did that, and go on.
Verstappen's 'defending' moves (BAR ONE) were absolutely perfect and first-class real F1 driver material. He positioned his car in such way that the other driver simply could not overtake.
What should he do then? Raikkonen/Perez on the far left, and because they're close, just brake more, turn in sharper and let them pass - essentialy, bend over and let them have some?
that's not racing. F1 perhaps has gone too soft and mushy, like 'oh wait, he's over there, i must give him room now'. That's not racing, thats not defending, thats giving up.
We've got artificial trash enough like DRS, giving up is killing the sport.
If Raikkonen wants to take over, if Perez wants to, go ahead, and get in front further and then get through the corner.
If neither Perez nor Raikkonen is able to MAKE the OUTSIDE overtake by staying on track, then the move simply doesnt cut it, and that's just it.
Try again next lap. Verstappen is a hard case to overtake, he puts his car in the exact right spot without actually being really dangerous.
People adored Senna, but Senna made the same or even 'dirtier' moves, and for Schumacher we dont even have to go there........
Matter of fact,
Vettel did some moves you might raise some eyebrows with in the past, and the exact same goes for Kimi.
Kimi got frustrated, and though he made some daring and amazing moves in the past in Spa, you could concider those moves potentially super dangerous too.
Its all part of F1, simple as that.
the only occasion that was eyebrow-raising was when Max went abruptly to the right with the speed difference. I still think that was acceptable. Really hard and brutal,
but he is in front. He did not weave, he did not change lines more than once. Verstappen essentially neutralised the DRS benefit there. So if there was a moment you could
point a finger at Verstappen, that would definately be it.
I think Sainz keeping on driving with the rear wing sideways on 3 wheels and 1 off, with one front wheel in the air was rather more dangerous, especially when he spinned
coming back to the track at an impossible moment.
Verstappen drove brilliantly realising his car got big damage and as stated caused being 1,5 slower a lap. Verstappen made a great move at the first corner, but Vettel ruined
it for both himself, Raikkonen and Verstappen. Vettel cut that corner too tight, and should have taken the corner a bit more roomy. If Vettel did not hit Raikkonen, Raikkonen
never would have hit Verstappen and damaging him, nor would Raikkonen get the puncture.
Imho that however was simply racing incident and a bit characteristic for Spa. But it DID immediately create the domino effect for the rest of the race.
Kimi has nobody to blame but himself, and the media obviously LOVES this stuff as it creates great headlines.
I love Verstappens comment 'if they dont like that, then that's their problem, not mine'. He's absolutely right.
The only really dangerous and worrysome thing that happened during the SPA GP was Magnussen's crash and the head protection coming off. that's far more worrying than
some tight racing.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"
