More Moderators Please

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dans79
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Re: More Moderators Please

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turbof1 wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 10:56 pm
We'll reserve judgement on that on a case by case :wink: . Vyssion used a specific stylistic way of writing here. The point here is not to troll, but to get a certain message across. In this case you have to see the few words you took into isolation as part of the whole post. You only wished to react on the small parts there were harshly written, but with an underlying reason. There is more to his post then just that part you want to put underneath a lens.

But again, we reserve the right to judge that in each seperate case.

well in my opinion, the entire post is in violation of the rule because as i see it the entire post is about "expressing favouritism or dislike towards people"!
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Steven
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Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 5:32 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: More Moderators Please

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Manoah2u wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 10:50 pm
'LEWIS SUX' does not get adressed.
Oh really? How many posts have you seen appear from that poster then?

You think that guy registered and isn't posting? Please refrain from commenting as if you know it all without knowing what's really going on.

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:07 pm

Re: More Moderators Please

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Steven wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:01 pm
Manoah2u wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 10:50 pm
'LEWIS SUX' does not get adressed.
Oh really? How many posts have you seen appear from that poster then?

You think that guy registered and isn't posting? Please refrain from commenting as if you know it all without knowing what's really going on.
the mere EXISTANCE of this member name should not be allowed.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"

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Steven
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Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 5:32 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: More Moderators Please

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Manoah2u wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:08 pm
Steven wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:01 pm
Manoah2u wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 10:50 pm
'LEWIS SUX' does not get adressed.
Oh really? How many posts have you seen appear from that poster then?

You think that guy registered and isn't posting? Please refrain from commenting as if you know it all without knowing what's really going on.
the mere EXISTANCE of this member name should not be allowed.
It's not up to you to decide how the moderator team handles suspicious accounts.
Perhaps you should be happy we are dealing with them, but you're clearly past this point.

You feel entitled to complain about everything the mods do but still, you have one of the most impressive moderator interaction records of all members around here. The number of warnings and informal messages sent to you are hardly quantifiable, yet you think you are the example of the forum.

You do realise that that are numerous members who manage to never get warnings or mod notes in over 10 years of presence on this forum, right?

Anyway, this is off-topic. I'm happy to discuss possible improvements, and read personal aggravations via PM, but those who feel they can just bash on the mods without any specific arguments aren't going to be taken into account.

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:07 pm

Re: More Moderators Please

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so your example of PM-ing me the way you did is an example of correct behaviour?
conveniantly removing that.

pot-kettle.

either way, it's available for everyone to see now how you treat your valued members.
it's also rich to attack me this way when the reason for that is because of confronting posters with their behaviour warrants sore 'reports' and then investigations, instead of working as it should, adressing the initiators.

the hypocrisy here is mind-boggling.

your mods and yourself (seen in your pm) contradict their own statements and go straight against the self-imposed forum rules. who am i? a fellow member in a public, open board for all to see. for all to see just how you treat your members.

and still, despite all, you don't concider that there might actually BE an issue at hand and announce an investigation and see to improve the forum experience and fairness and policies.

instead, you dive deep and deep into a sewerpit and sling the hardest it seems.

no conversation, just this:

Image
Last edited by Manoah2u on Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"

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dans79
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Location: USA

Re: More Moderators Please

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Steven wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:16 pm
Anyway, this is off-topic. I'm happy to discuss possible improvements, and read personal aggravations via PM, but those who feel they can just bash on the mods without any specific arguments aren't going to be taken into account.
May I ask why you never responded to the pms nzjrs and I sent you on November 21st about additional moderators?
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Steven
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Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 5:32 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: More Moderators Please

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dans79 wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:22 pm
Steven wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:16 pm
Anyway, this is off-topic. I'm happy to discuss possible improvements, and read personal aggravations via PM, but those who feel they can just bash on the mods without any specific arguments aren't going to be taken into account.
May I ask why you never responded to the pms nzjrs and I sent you on November 21st about additional moderators?
Time constraints. Insufficient mods, too many extreme posts, and real life. I'm sorry, I don't get paid to do this fulltime, however much I'd like to have more presence around here.

Also, I'll leave manoah's screenshot online this time. Nothing to hide in hindsight.

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: More Moderators Please

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Vyssion wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 10:41 pm

This is not your site. You do not dictate how it is run. You are entitled to nothing. And quite interestingly, a lot of the people posting here are the exact same people who I see troll and stir up trouble in threads all over the place, and of whom I also hear getting handed bans and reprimand DM's from mods time and again from my conversations with the F1T site management team.
Ignoring the invective rant, the highlighted portion is somewhat interesting. Surprising that the mods discuss the actions they are taking against forum members with someone who isn't a moderator. Or are you a special case being a writer of articles?
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

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jjn9128
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Re: More Moderators Please

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Vyssion wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 10:41 pm
So I have read through this thread in it's entirety and all I can say is holy sh*t, some of you people's self-aggrandizing entitlement...

This is not your site. You do not dictate how it is run. You are entitled to nothing. And quite interestingly, a lot of the people posting here are the exact same people who I see troll and stir up trouble in threads all over the place, and of whom I also hear getting handed bans and reprimand DM's from mods time and again from my conversations with the F1T site management team.

If you are a HAM fan, then according to you, all VER fans are the devil's worshipers and are all biased against HAM with an IQ in the single digits who is incapable on thinking rationally, logically, or seeing it from your "perfect perspective".

If you are a VER fan, then according to you, all HAM fans are the devil's worshipers and are all biased against VER with an IQ in the single digits who is incapable on thinking rationally, logically, or seeing it from your "perfect perspective".

The way I see it is that none of you are capable of having conversation between yourselves of which you are able to put aside your emotional differences and be objective. Yes; this season is full of controversy. People dislike HAM, and people dislike VER. Your opponent isn't wrong simply because, when it comes to subjective material, they think differently to you.

All I see in this thread are a bunch of immature children who are throwing their toys out the pram because they believe that their sh*t should stick instead of the other person's.
I broadly agree with the above. Maybe as a Brit vs Australian I change some wording to be more... diplomatic...

If you are often finding yourself on the wrong side of the mods perhaps there needs to be more introspection and a change of behaviour because the answers are probably within rather than with the mods. This season has been a fractuous one with acrimony from both sides in the title battle, but the contenders (drivers not the team bosses) have generally acted with more grace than a bunch of online keyboard warriors with no real skin in the game. More mods is probably not a bad thing but don't pretend you want it for any other reason than you're being unable to accept views from outside your own idealogical bubble.
#aerogandalf
"There is one big friend. It is downforce. And once you have this it’s a big mate and it’s helping a lot." Robert Kubica

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: More Moderators Please

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Steven wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:27 pm
dans79 wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:22 pm
Steven wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:16 pm
Anyway, this is off-topic. I'm happy to discuss possible improvements, and read personal aggravations via PM, but those who feel they can just bash on the mods without any specific arguments aren't going to be taken into account.
May I ask why you never responded to the pms nzjrs and I sent you on November 21st about additional moderators?
Time constraints. Insufficient mods, too many extreme posts, and real life. I'm sorry, I don't get paid to do this fulltime, however much I'd like to have more presence around here.

Also, I'll leave manoah's screenshot online this time. Nothing to hide in hindsight.
Steven, you mention insufficient mods - this whole thread started as a request for more mods. Is there any likely movement in this direction, assuming you can find suitable people to volunteer? I'm sure everyone would welcome some additional mods to help patrol the corridors of the forum.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: More Moderators Please

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jjn9128 wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:36 pm


I broadly agree with the above. Maybe as a Brit vs Australian I change some wording to be more... diplomatic...
Ooh, controversial! :wink: :lol: :lol:












(Sorry, couldn't resist and just trying to add some levity to the thread...)
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

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Steven
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Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 5:32 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: More Moderators Please

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Just_a_fan wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:37 pm
Steven, you mention insufficient mods - this whole thread started as a request for more mods. Is there any likely movement in this direction, assuming you can find suitable people to volunteer? I'm sure everyone would welcome some additional mods to help patrol the corridors of the forum.
I'm not so sure if we can realistically expect to find "suitable volunteers" in this climate.
And nobody volunteered since this topic got started :wink:

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dans79
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Re: More Moderators Please

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jjn9128 wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:36 pm
More mods is probably not a bad thing but don't pretend you want it for any other reason than you're being unable to accept views from outside your own idealogical bubble.
I have no problem with views from outside of my "ideological bubble", as should be evident by the fact that nzjrs and I (who sit on vastly different sides of the isle), came together and contacted Steven about fixing what we both perceived to be the underlying issue! An insufficient number of moderators, and an excessive number of users who's sole reason for frequenting the forum seems to be to antagonize and taunt members who don't live in the same bubble as them.

For example I reported a post a little over a week ago that contained nothing but a one-liner that started with an expletive, and described a team principle by relating him to a dog, a old black and white tv character of diminished mental capacity, and a term that would be considered derogatory in most schools today.

I found that to be completely unacceptable, and the moderation staff did as well. And this is far from the first time said user has done something similar.

The problem as I and several other users (that I know) see it, is that's the rule and by extension the moderators do not do enough to prevent this type discourse. Not to mention myself and many other users are past the point of Turing a blind eye to such provocations. Thus the forum will most likely continue to deteriorate until some kind of line in the sand is drawn!
Last edited by dans79 on Wed Dec 15, 2021 1:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: More Moderators Please

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Steven wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:46 pm
Just_a_fan wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:37 pm
Steven, you mention insufficient mods - this whole thread started as a request for more mods. Is there any likely movement in this direction, assuming you can find suitable people to volunteer? I'm sure everyone would welcome some additional mods to help patrol the corridors of the forum.
I'm not so sure if we can realistically expect to find "suitable volunteers" in this climate.
And nobody volunteered since this topic got started :wink:
Very early on there was a quick spat between a few people saying "I wouldn't accept him as a mod" if I remember correctly. That's part of the problem, of course.

I do still wonder if the forum should be two zones with the arguing race threads being more hands-off, but other areas being much more protected. The technical threads are generally well behaved, even where some of the protagonists in the race threads are in there discussing a subject not involving drivers or teams.

There are certain areas that are more prone to emotional content. Perhaps it should just be a case of "abandon hope all ye who enter here" / "enter at your own risk". If moderator resources are limited, using them in the more important areas makes more sense. Just a thought.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:07 pm

Re: More Moderators Please

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Steven wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:46 pm
Just_a_fan wrote:
Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:37 pm
Steven, you mention insufficient mods - this whole thread started as a request for more mods. Is there any likely movement in this direction, assuming you can find suitable people to volunteer? I'm sure everyone would welcome some additional mods to help patrol the corridors of the forum.
I'm not so sure if we can realistically expect to find "suitable volunteers" in this climate.
that climate is exactly what caused the problem in the first place, and gets people to think warrants 'more mods' when reality is that it's greatly the moderation itself.

again, it starts with bias and hypocrisy. the posts above show just that. Anti-Hamilton threads and comments get free reign, get reported, and when suggested to be closed - like happens with so many threads for a reason - the stance of the mods (as shown above again) is an agressive YOU DONT TELL US WHAT TO DO.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=30038

vs when something about the orange board god is presented in any negative way (i got a warning for calling the usual suspects orange army), it gets closed in a snap

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=30072

if you think that in an international board this doesn't provoke annoyance and irritation, then the mods are really looking through coloured glasses and ostriching.

the funniest part of it all, this trend has been reported many times before and concerned members even went to open a thread about it - which is obviously because they don't feel taken serious, and because insufficient action is taken. nobody says NO action is undertaken - it is however still insufficient.

i present to you the 'whistleblowers' if you may

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=29980
SiLo wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:42 pm
LM10 wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:30 pm


I wonder though, what's the reason for that shift to childish behaviour lately?
Big increase in new fans coming in and popularity of the website. Everything online is becoming more tribal these days because we can all find countless people that agree with exactly what we are saying, so we are all convinced we are right.
dans79 wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:51 pm

We've also seen an influx of user accounts that seem to solely exist to make posts aimed at antagonizing the fans of a given driver or team!
Just_a_fan wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:13 pm

Exactly. The technical threads are quiet with just a little bit of activity between people discussing technical things of one sort or another, but the race and team threads are just awash with people that have turned up this year (coincidence?) and just bombard, argue and insult. These threads are now more akin to reddit than F1 Technical. :roll:
El Scorchio wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:45 pm

Funny you should mention reddit. I was thinking the very same thing about an hour ago! It feels like it's half descended into a reddit page or facebook post, with people posting 'funny' memes (one rather distasteful one in the 'caption competition' thread today) and gifs, and acting only to wind other people up rather than attempt reasonable discussion.
WaikeCU wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:40 pm
How this exists more and more?

Easy: Cancel Culture
DChemTech wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:03 pm
maxxer wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:00 pm
To be honest im dutch but not living there for awhile , but i have seen this behaviour happening more and more there on dutch fora which are not even about motorsports and I have seen dutch outside of their country becoming very rude
I dont know if its education or such but i have seen my country people becoming pretty arrogant over the years "we are the best" kind of attitude.
Living abroad i have noticed this more and more
Oh, I wouldn't touch the comment sections of gptoday or motorsport.com/nl or something likewise with a 10 foot broompole while wearing a Hazmat suit. Or the ones at nu.nl, for that matter. (
Just_a_fan wrote:
Sat Oct 02, 2021 1:22 am
hollus wrote:
Fri Oct 01, 2021 10:03 pm
Care to point exactly what is denigratory there? Please elaborate.

I’d say the dutch media are about as dutch biased as the British media are British biased. I know I suffered that in 2007 when the Spanish media were ridiculously pro-spanish biased for good balance. And let’s not start with Schumacher and RTL. And the world is round and spins.
This is ok?
British personnel in generally are biased to a point of toxicity
If it's considered ok on this forum then you can kiss goodbye to it being anything other than a toxic dump.

What next? General negative comments about black people, or Muslims, or Jews?

Is it ok to say that Germans are all anti-semitic? After all, there is a documented history about that.

You can kill this now, or you can lose the forum. Your choice. Which is it?
funny how Just_a_fan literally named what is happening back then, and how it is still now.

as from that same thread
cooken wrote:
Sat Oct 02, 2021 1:23 pm
So, the mods and site owner are fine with people making denigratory statements about a group of people based on nationality. I see a bit of a problem there....no?

Lest we forget, there is a big difference in stating:
"British people are likely to have a bias for British drivers."
and
"British people are biased to the point of toxicity".

The latter goes a step too far, and is unnecessarily flamboyant. It is also untrue; the original context was in claiming lack of critical assessment of Lewis, while it is well established that several members of the British media (let alone the British public) hold nothing but contempt for him.
full circle again.

i remember this
nzjrs wrote:
Tue Nov 16, 2021 6:48 pm
Deafening silence from the mods. Ciao Bella.
and several people are now getting really fed up with this.

for months people have been kindly asking the mods to act rationally and correctly, and fairly,
out of fear that things turn into what it is now. and now people - including me - are harshly adressing
the policy, and mods run and hide, ignore, censor, and more, and try to paint the people that have been
adressing incompetence as the actual 'bad ones'.
dans79 wrote:
Wed Dec 15, 2021 12:06 am

I have no problem with views from outside of my "ideological bubble", as should be evident by the fact that nzjrs I (who sit on vastly different sides of the isle), came together and contacted Steven about fixing what we both perceived to be the underlying issue! An insufficient number of moderators, and an excessive number of users who's sole reason for frequenting the forum seems to be to antagonize and taunt members who don't live in the same bubble as them.

For example I reported a post a little over a week ago that contained nothing but a oneliner that started with an expletive, and described a team principle by relating him to a dog, a old black and white tv character of diminished mental capacity, and a term that would be considered derogatory in most schools today.

I found that to be completely unacceptable, and the moderation staff did as well. And this is far from the first time said user has done something similar.

The problem as I and several other users (that I know) see it, is that's the rule and by extension the moderators do not do enough to prevent this type discourse. Not to mention myself and many other users are past the point of Turing a blind eye to such provocations. Thus most forum will most likely continue to deteriorate until some kind of line in the sand is drawn!
so i again present the issue at hand.
is it the lack of mods, or the proven bias of the mods themselves that have tarnished the conduct of this board?

but i have left my say, and left my mark sufficiently now. i can only hope something, at some point, will come out of this.

with nzjrs, as i mentioned before, adios.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"