2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
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adrianjordan
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Location: West Yorkshire, England

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Thu May 12, 2022 5:07 am
Dr. Acula wrote:
Wed May 11, 2022 4:45 pm
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed May 11, 2022 4:15 pm


That material doesn't affect MRI or cat-scan they say. A small chunk of platinum. Remember there are people with dental and skeletal braces too. Are dental braces banned too? See, there is no logic to it. There needs to be a review of what sorts of materials and forms of Jewelry are allowed. Checks all the boxes? You're good to go race.
Ferromagnetic metals like Iron, Nickel and Cobalt are indeed a problem for an MRI though. Ironbased medical implants in general are so highly alloyed that they lose their magnetic properties, so they aren't a problem.
The issue in reality is that most people don't actually know what their piercings are exactly made of. For instance Nickel isn't an unusual material to find in piercings.
A quick goolge search shows that even for stainless steel sutures the level of image artifacts are small, and the temperature rise is like 2 degrees celcius under an MRI. The was no sigificant magnetic pull because of the small size of the items.

Platinum is not magnetic so this wouldn't be an issue for a nose knob. No artifacts, no heating, no magnetic pull.

FIA has enforced a lazy ruling to target one driver.
Moreover the initial assessment after trauma is done using a CT scan, with an MRI only used a a secondary tool.

Added to that, I guarantee it would take less time to remove that nose stud in the MRI prep area, than to remove a wedding band (which are permitted) from a finger which is broken and swelling up causing a risk of blood supply issues.

I have never had a single patient where a piercing caused a problem with emergency assessment or any kind of assessment for that matter.

The only items of jewellery that case issues are rings when hands swell.

Well, and nipple piercings if we're having to defibrillate someone, but at that point a burnt nipple is the least of their worries!!

Necklaces are easily removed and piercings are never a problem unless they're the primary cause of injury (earing ripped out) which is something I can't imagine happening in F1!!
Favourite driver: Lando Norris
Favourite team: McLaren

Turned down the chance to meet Vettel at Silverstone in 2007. He was a test driver at the time and I didn't think it was worth queuing!! 🤦🏻‍♂️

CHT
CHT
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Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 4:24 am

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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adrianjordan wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 5:06 pm
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Thu May 12, 2022 5:07 am
Dr. Acula wrote:
Wed May 11, 2022 4:45 pm

Ferromagnetic metals like Iron, Nickel and Cobalt are indeed a problem for an MRI though. Ironbased medical implants in general are so highly alloyed that they lose their magnetic properties, so they aren't a problem.
The issue in reality is that most people don't actually know what their piercings are exactly made of. For instance Nickel isn't an unusual material to find in piercings.
A quick goolge search shows that even for stainless steel sutures the level of image artifacts are small, and the temperature rise is like 2 degrees celcius under an MRI. The was no sigificant magnetic pull because of the small size of the items.

Platinum is not magnetic so this wouldn't be an issue for a nose knob. No artifacts, no heating, no magnetic pull.

FIA has enforced a lazy ruling to target one driver.
Moreover the initial assessment after trauma is done using a CT scan, with an MRI only used a a secondary tool.

Added to that, I guarantee it would take less time to remove that nose stud in the MRI prep area, than to remove a wedding band (which are permitted) from a finger which is broken and swelling up causing a risk of blood supply issues.

I have never had a single patient where a piercing caused a problem with emergency assessment or any kind of assessment for that matter.

The only items of jewellery that case issues are rings when hands swell.

Well, and nipple piercings if we're having to defibrillate someone, but at that point a burnt nipple is the least of their worries!!

Necklaces are easily removed and piercings are never a problem unless they're the primary cause of injury (earing ripped out) which is something I can't imagine happening in F1!!
Time will be required to check through every part of the driver to confirm there are no piercings or jewellery. That will include time to strip the driver and turn his body over for inspection. For a driver who has a bad concussion and broken bones or a broken skull, moving the body may be dangerous or even impossible.

From FIA point of view, they have to consider the worst-case scenario, not based on expert experience or opinion because they are accountable for driver safety and 1 life lost is 1 too many.

silver
silver
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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So many pages of totally off topic content. =D> Other than a Mercedes driver wears a jewellery that breaks a rule, everything else need to go to a Metallurgy thread.

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2021 12:22 am

Re: Mercedes W13

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Interesting comments from Miami GP organizers about how the track surface changed between Friday and Saturday. This may be the hidden piece of the puzzle for Mercedes:

Apparently, the track had an electrostatic treatment on Saturday morning. It's likely that the car worked in Friday track conditions, but was not setup for the new conditions on Saturday. Narrow setup window.

https://www.planetf1.com/news/miami-tra ... omplaints/
“Next year, we’ll start conditioning the track sooner with FOD BOSS, which is an electrostatic way of lifting debris off a circuit,” he said.

“So because it’s such an abrasive, rough surface, in fact all race tracks are, if you blow it, the little critters still sit in the valleys.

“If you sweep it, the same thing happens, you need to lift it vertically. And on Saturday morning, we started using the FOD BOSSes, and from that point forward, the track came to us.

“The one regret, I didn’t arrange for the FOD BOSS machines to do their work on the Thursday and the Friday. I just wish that I had made sure that they had run earlier.”

Spoutnik
Spoutnik
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Re: Mercedes W13

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ringo wrote:
Sun May 15, 2022 2:32 pm
The slight flaws i see though is that these floors are much stiffer than the floors of the past. Secondly the micro pod design is almost just as wide at the base.
If you look on the alfa romeo car also that undercut where the sidepod connects to the floor is even more inward than how the w13 sidepods connect so that floor should be less stiff than than the W13.
So im not really a proponent of that floor stifness theory.
What could be happening is the W13 is set much lower at speed than the other cars and the momentary loads it generates are greater.
Mercedes i think are putting all their eggs into this ground effect basket and are hoping to get it right so they can dominante the second half of the season.
As we see ferrari still bounces, but it is more controlled and the car doesnt seem as low as the w13 because its sidepods generate force.
Redbull seems pretty low, but have a trick suspension.
What a championship battle this would be !

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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silver wrote:
Sun May 15, 2022 8:43 am
So many pages of totally off topic content. =D> Other than a Mercedes driver wears a jewellery that breaks a rule, everything else need to go to a Metallurgy thread.
It's not-off topic. It is a FIA ruling about a team member that is falling foul to it.

Anyway here is a good synopsis of the driver and car performance so far as we to Barcelona.

🖐️✌️☝️👀👌

====Zen level====
|||||||<@>||^||<@>|||||||

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Big Tea
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Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 7:57 pm

Re: Mercedes W13

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Spoutnik wrote:
Sun May 15, 2022 3:35 pm
ringo wrote:
Sun May 15, 2022 2:32 pm
The slight flaws i see though is that these floors are much stiffer than the floors of the past. Secondly the micro pod design is almost just as wide at the base.
If you look on the alfa romeo car also that undercut where the sidepod connects to the floor is even more inward than how the w13 sidepods connect so that floor should be less stiff than than the W13.
So im not really a proponent of that floor stifness theory.
What could be happening is the W13 is set much lower at speed than the other cars and the momentary loads it generates are greater.
Mercedes i think are putting all their eggs into this ground effect basket and are hoping to get it right so they can dominante the second half of the season.
As we see ferrari still bounces, but it is more controlled and the car doesnt seem as low as the w13 because its sidepods generate force.
Redbull seems pretty low, but have a trick suspension.
What a championship battle this would be !
And a flying start into next years car. Just getting the 'missing' second of correlation back would be huge, but having a solid base line to move over to next years car would mean starting level or above the others.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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adrianjordan
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Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 10:34 am
Location: West Yorkshire, England

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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CHT wrote:
Sun May 15, 2022 1:47 am
adrianjordan wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 5:06 pm
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Thu May 12, 2022 5:07 am


A quick goolge search shows that even for stainless steel sutures the level of image artifacts are small, and the temperature rise is like 2 degrees celcius under an MRI. The was no sigificant magnetic pull because of the small size of the items.

Platinum is not magnetic so this wouldn't be an issue for a nose knob. No artifacts, no heating, no magnetic pull.

FIA has enforced a lazy ruling to target one driver.
Moreover the initial assessment after trauma is done using a CT scan, with an MRI only used a a secondary tool.

Added to that, I guarantee it would take less time to remove that nose stud in the MRI prep area, than to remove a wedding band (which are permitted) from a finger which is broken and swelling up causing a risk of blood supply issues.

I have never had a single patient where a piercing caused a problem with emergency assessment or any kind of assessment for that matter.

The only items of jewellery that case issues are rings when hands swell.

Well, and nipple piercings if we're having to defibrillate someone, but at that point a burnt nipple is the least of their worries!!

Necklaces are easily removed and piercings are never a problem unless they're the primary cause of injury (earing ripped out) which is something I can't imagine happening in F1!!
Time will be required to check through every part of the driver to confirm there are no piercings or jewellery. That will include time to strip the driver and turn his body over for inspection. For a driver who has a bad concussion and broken bones or a broken skull, moving the body may be dangerous or even impossible.

From FIA point of view, they have to consider the worst-case scenario, not based on expert experience or opinion because they are accountable for driver safety and 1 life lost is 1 too many.
They will do a complete top to toe survey anyway, which will include a controlled log roll to assess the patient's back and in particular spine.

And Lewis is only talking about his nose ring. It's not like he wants to wear all his chains etc.

A simple solution would be the driver signing a waiver and declaring what jewellery they are wearing. Simple and effective.
Favourite driver: Lando Norris
Favourite team: McLaren

Turned down the chance to meet Vettel at Silverstone in 2007. He was a test driver at the time and I didn't think it was worth queuing!! 🤦🏻‍♂️

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chrisc90
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Joined: Wed Feb 23, 2022 8:22 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Didn’t Lewis say he had others that he didn’t want to tell people about in a interview other week? Everyone knows he had a nose stud
No Mikey Noo! No! Nooo Mikey! That was sooo not riiight!!

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Stu
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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He did. How much risk are either nipple or genital piercings in a big head-on collision?
Makes me shudder, just contemplating it!
The more that I learn, the more I appreciate how much more there is to know….

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chrisc90
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Joined: Wed Feb 23, 2022 8:22 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Stu wrote:
Mon May 16, 2022 11:36 am
He did. How much risk are either nipple or genital piercings in a big head-on collision?
Makes me shudder, just contemplating it!
Just imagine it…. 2 shoulder/body straps across your nipples, and a crotch strap. Does bring pain even at the thought of it!
No Mikey Noo! No! Nooo Mikey! That was sooo not riiight!!

cplchanb
cplchanb
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Stu wrote:
Mon May 16, 2022 11:36 am
He did. How much risk are either nipple or genital piercings in a big head-on collision?
Makes me shudder, just contemplating it!
Honestly, if ham was ever in a collision that his nose stud would be a danger to his health, it would most likely be a
fatal one anyways. There is no evidence that suggests that nose studs would impede on removing his helmet or causing harm in an accident. If his helmet is smashed in to the point its catching on the stud hams already dead most likely.

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Stu
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Location: Norfolk, UK

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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I’m not talking about the nose stud, but the “another one that I cannot show you” piercing….

The nose stud is all a bit ‘meh’ really, more private piercings could prove dangerous!
The more that I learn, the more I appreciate how much more there is to know….

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wogx
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Image

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organic
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Location: Cambridge, UK

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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This is the source for these numbers by the way