Mercedes AMG F1 W03

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
User avatar
ringo
240
Joined: 29 Mar 2009, 10:57

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

Crucial_Xtreme wrote:New vent for driver cooling. Looks like the hole in the nose is not for driver cooling, it's for the FW.

Image
Maybe they both are for driver cooling. One was just not big enough for this track in particular.
For Sure!!

User avatar
yener
4
Joined: 09 May 2011, 00:00

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

flickster wrote:
Robbobnob wrote:Well if that nose duct isnt primarily for driver cooling, then it must be in breach of the regulations!!
I really don't think MGP would have missed something that straight forward, they know what they are doing.
He was trying to funny and sarcastic
"Life is about passions - Thank you for sharing mine" MSC

Crucial_Xtreme
Crucial_Xtreme
404
Joined: 16 Oct 2011, 00:13
Location: Charlotte

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

New driver cooling duct & good look at suspension & turning vanes. Right click>view image
Image

Good look at the front bulkhead
Image
Image

User avatar
Gerhardsa
6
Joined: 20 May 2011, 14:35
Location: Canada 'eh!

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

Robbobnob wrote:Well if that nose duct isnt primarily for driver cooling, then it must be in breach of the regulations!!
Like RBR who is still blowing the Exhaust...

Mr.S
Mr.S
0
Joined: 09 Apr 2011, 18:21

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

The car is mechanically pretty bad. I have been saying this from the pre-season tests. Traction,mechanical grip is a huge issue. I was seeing FP2 session(live streaming),its just not good enough in the slow sectors.

W02 was also bad mechanically. People were saying its aerodynamically not up to the mark but mechanically the W02 was much worse. Same case this year. Bit of a dog in slow speed zones. The two straights are saving the sectors times in S1 & S2.


Aldo Costa needs to work hard.

User avatar
raymondu999
54
Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 07:31

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

Gary Anderson wrote:Mercedes have already attracted a lot of attention this season because of a controversial aerodynamic system on their car - and this weekend in Malaysia it could put them right up in the battle for pole position.
Sepang is one of the tracks where the system, which further boosts the effectiveness of the DRS overtaking aid, will be most advantageous in terms of one-off lap time.
However, it could also have the opposite effect in the race and be detrimental to their pace during the grand prix.
Before we get into why, we'll have to explain how the system works.
All cars have the DRS - which moves a flap on the rear wing to reduce drag and therefore increase straight-line speed.
Its use is free in practice and qualifying but is limited in the race to a specific zone on the track - in Malaysia, the main straight - and only when a driver is within a second of the car in front at a 'detection point' just before the 'DRS zone'.
On the Mercedes, the flap moves on the rear wing in the same way as on all the other cars. The difference is that when it lifts, it reveals holes on the inside of the endplates.
Continue reading the main story

I can see the system allowing them to knock on the door of pole position in qualifying - but hurting the rear tyres in the race

Gary Anderson
These holes connect up through channels through the car to slot gaps on the underside of the front wing - and when the DRS opens, the low-pressure air under the front wing sucks air through the car from the rear wing, reducing the effectiveness of the front wing.
In Malaysia, there are fast corners where the car has enough inherent downforce to enable the driver to run with the DRS open if the set-up is right.
Normally, reducing the rear downforce in that way through a fast corner increases oversteer - which is instability at the rear of the car. That can limit how fast a driver can go through the bend.
But because the Mercedes system reduces front downforce, that means their car can maintain a consistent balance while also benefiting from the top-speed boost of the DRS.
In qualifying, that allows the Mercedes drivers to travel a much greater distance on a given lap with the DRS open. Which should give them a reasonable percentage of lap-time gain - and therefore a substantial advantage.
But in the race it is a different matter.
For a start, DRS use is limited to the main straight, so the advantage gained in fast corners and on other straights in qualifying is no longer there.
On top of that, a specific characteristic of the system could hurt Mercedes's chances.
When the DRS closes, because there is a volume of air in the system, the rear downforce comes back on to the car quicker than the front downforce.
It might only be a 10th of a second or so - but it does mean the rear of the car is stable earlier. That's a good thing for braking stability.
But in the race the system will only be used rarely and therefore the aerodynamic characteristics of the car on corner entry will be quite different - and use the rear tyres more aggressively because the rear will be moving around more.
So I can see the system allowing them to knock on the door of pole position in qualifying - but hurting the rear tyres in the race.
That is exactly the problem Mercedes had in Australia last weekend.
失败者找理由,成功者找方法

NewtonMeter
NewtonMeter
5
Joined: 24 Jun 2010, 21:48
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

raymondu999 wrote:
Gary Anderson wrote: But in the race the system will only be used rarely and therefore the aerodynamic characteristics of the car on corner entry will be quite different - and use the rear tyres more aggressively because the rear will be moving around more.
So I can see the system allowing them to knock on the door of pole position in qualifying - but hurting the rear tyres in the race.
That is exactly the problem Mercedes had in Australia last weekend.
I don't understand. Why would the rear move around more in the race? I would think in the race it would move around less. Because:

- In Qualy, the DRS will be open more often, therefore less downforce (front and rear), therefore more degradation.

- In race, the DRS will be open less, therefore more downforce, therefore less degradation.

I honestly don't see what the DRS (front and rear) has to do with their degradation. When the system is closed, it should function exactly like any other car.

Am I missing something? I have massive respect for any F1 engineer including Mr Anderson, but might this not be a case of finding something different on the car and pinning the (alleged) problem on that?
Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool...

e30ernest
e30ernest
27
Joined: 29 Feb 2012, 08:47

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

Possibly due to the added weight of fuel.

NewtonMeter
NewtonMeter
5
Joined: 24 Jun 2010, 21:48
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

e30ernest wrote:Possibly due to the added weight of fuel.
Yeah, but that's the same for everyone.
Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool...

mahesh248
mahesh248
0
Joined: 05 Mar 2007, 12:05
Location: India

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

[quote="NewtonMeter"][quote="e30ernest"]Possibly due to the added weight of fuel.[/quote]

Yeah, but that's the same for everyone.[/quote]

Mclaren and redbull , are managing the wear better than Merc , and yeah I don't understand how lack of DRS use in the race is affecting the wear rate reported by Gary Anderson .

User avatar
MBilcke
1
Joined: 22 Mar 2012, 13:55
Location: Ypres, Belgium

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

Crucial_Xtreme wrote:New driver cooling duct & good look at suspension & turning vanes. Right click>view image
Image
Is it the first time that the turning vanes have this horizontal FW-ish section at the end?
And about the cooling duct, does it not look to have a big impact in the airflow on top of the nose? Because the middle section of the broken nose seams to guide air over the cockpit, and then you have that big snorkle there? And why is there no grill in it to prevent debris to hit the drivers precious parts?

User avatar
pocketmoon
0
Joined: 17 Oct 2011, 23:14

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

NewtonMeter wrote: I don't understand. Why would the rear move around more in the race? I would think in the race it would move around less. Because:

- In Qualy, the DRS will be open more often, therefore less downforce (front and rear), therefore more degradation.

- In race, the DRS will be open less, therefore more downforce, therefore less degradation.

I honestly don't see what the DRS (front and rear) has to do with their degradation. When the system is closed, it should function exactly like any other car.
You can't change the car setup between Quali and Race (apart from those adjustments allowed in race). So there are two set-ups ; one that's optimum for hot lapping with DRS open whenever you want and one for racing when DRS is open in rare circumstances. Gary suggests that the car balance is sub-optimal for race and hence heavier on tyres.

Crucial_Xtreme
Crucial_Xtreme
404
Joined: 16 Oct 2011, 00:13
Location: Charlotte

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

I've never noticed 4 strakes on the diffuser. Guess I wasn't paying attention.

Image

bhall
bhall
244
Joined: 28 Feb 2006, 21:26

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

(Apologies if this is, in any way, a repeat of a previous discussion.)

Image
(Click to enlarge)

Small blue dots: Ductwork from the intake on top of the chassis to the front wing?
Red dot: Extension to couple the top duct to the front wing?

User avatar
AnthonyG
38
Joined: 03 Mar 2012, 13:16

Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W03

Post

About the F-duct FW, I can understand the benefits of stalling the front wing on a straight, but in a youtube video they claim it stalls certain parts of the wing in cornering. (depending on wheter you corner left or right)
Isn't that just crap? Wouldn't a better way of making it work just stalling the wing in a straight line and letting the air flow to another place then the front wing (cockpit) in corners?
Thank you really doesn't really describe enough what I feel. - Vettel