Mercedes AMG F1 W03

[King Six]

Scarbs has made you a very rich man

Well not rich but

Edit:

I guess I should have used something a little more apparent than blue dots on the picture I presented earlier.


(Click to enlarge)

You're quoted by Craig Scarborough @ScarbsF1:

BINGO! bhallg2k from @f1technical found the Merc FW ducts coming through the chassis (arrowed) http://bit.ly/GMeYQL

New page.

[issues4]

Is that legal?

I can confirm that Scarbs thanking bhallg2k for the discovery is 100% legal.

=D>

[Fredy4]

Surely this would be bordeline impossbile to copy without totally changing the chassis - including crash tests etc.

Indeed can you even change the tub mid season?

[King Six]

Surely this would be bordeline impossbile to copy without totally changing the chassis - including crash tests etc.

Indeed can you even change the tub mid season?

Well somehow the teams all found a way to copy McLaren's F-duct way back in '10. Although I asked this same question back in 2010, how did the teams copy the F-duct when you have all this chassis homogolation crash test ongoings. Forgot what the answer was, if there was one...

[Fredy4]

Surely this would be bordeline impossbile to copy without totally changing the chassis - including crash tests etc.

Indeed can you even change the tub mid season?

Well somehow the teams all found a way to copy McLaren's F-duct way back in '10. Although I asked this same question back in 2010, how did the teams copy the F-duct when you have all this chassis homogolation crash test ongoings. Forgot what the answer was, if there was one...

The rear was relatively easy though and all 'on top'.

[Dragonfly]

I am afraid you are seeing ghosts on that photo. It's an optical illusion from the CF layout which form a recess, containing the brake cylinders and tanks.
IMHO

[Ferraripilot]

Surely this would be bordeline impossbile to copy without totally changing the chassis - including crash tests etc.

Indeed can you even change the tub mid season?

Well somehow the teams all found a way to copy McLaren's F-duct way back in '10. Although I asked this same question back in 2010, how did the teams copy the F-duct when you have all this chassis homogolation crash test ongoings. Forgot what the answer was, if there was one...

The rear wing f-duct of 2010 was a much more simple beast compared to this though. The W03 unit as you can see involves complicated passages through the front wing, nose, crash structure, the rear wing, the beam wing, everywhere. Not an easy implimentation for other teams as so many parts must be changed.

And then the complicated issue of CAN it even be put onto other vehicles if they were not designed with this system in mind. It's like RB7s EBD in a sense that other teams did put it to use but only saw a fraction of the benefit. But of course this is far more complicated than just the EBD as the system routes through the entire car! What a nightmare! I'm sure many teams will not even bother with the system considering the time and expense involved for such a minor gain. Unless of course W03 starts destroying the field in qualifying each and every time, but I doubt it.

[bhall]

I don't get it! Where exactly is the air supposed to be flowing through the nose to the front wing!?

BINGO! bhallg2k from @f1technical found the Merc FW ducts coming through the chassis (arrowed) http://bit.ly/GMeYQL

You were saying?

(How cool is that? I'm not even going to try to hide the fact this tickles the sh*t out of me.)

[munudeges]

I'd be really curious as to how much of an effect they're getting from this. That's a lot of ducting.

[Ferraripilot]

I am afraid you are seeing ghosts on that photo. It's an optical illusion from the CF layout which form a recess, containing the brake cylinders and tanks.
IMHO

I'm not sure about that really. Have a look at the Red Bull and Mclaren with their noses off. They are nothing of the sort like this and give no indication of any sort of passage perhaps being present, or anything for that matter.

[Fredy4]

The more I look at that picture...

Are they even pipes or a flat surface witht the weave giving a 3D impression?

Look at it again, but with the fact its flat in your head.

[aral]

I am afraid you are seeing ghosts on that photo. It's an optical illusion from the CF layout which form a recess, containing the brake cylinders and tanks.
IMHO

Agreed. There would have to be a way for air to get from these supposed tubes, to the FW pylons, and there isn't.

[tok-tokkie]

Well done ballg2k. I looked at your picture with the blue & red dots but even then I failed to recognise what the blue dots were showing. Hence my post.
I agree with dragonfly that those are tubular shapes & it may be the inside curve of recesses for the brake fluid tanks.
EDIT: Looking again I see the 'tubes' are not directly behind the brake ffluid reservoirs. So the 'OR' case is much more likely.
OR they are two tubes pointing downwards joining to tubes in the nose cone leading to the wing pylons. Scarbs thinks this is what they are.
That the plate with the red dot is just to hide things when the car is on the pit stand also seems likely - why else would it be there?
I don't believe there is a fluidic switch. Air from the back is enough I expect.

[i70q7m7ghw]

The more I look at it, the more I feel the front wing is actually being blown by default to keep the flow attached, and is stalled when it's not blown.

The way I can see it working is:-

DRS IS NOT ACTIVATED - Air enters through the nose hole, pressure builds up in the nose cone and air is blown out through the slots on the underside of the wing, keeping the airflow attached and preventing the wing from stalling.

DRS IS ACTIVATED - The two ducts in the nose cone now release the pressure in the nose cone and allow the air to flow through the ducting and exit out the rear wing DRS-duct. The slots on the underside of the wing are not blown sufficiently to keep the airflow attached, and the wing stalls, reducing drag. This method essentially uses the DRS-duct as a release valve for the air in the nose cone.

The reason I believe this is more likely is that it's easier to implement. Doing it the other way round and blowing the wing to stall it would require a secondary exit from the nose cone - instead of the slots - and a complicated method of switching between the two exits using a pressure difference created from the DRS-duct.

This is ofcourse dependant on designing a wing that will stall when not blown, but reattach when blown at just the right amount, I'm sure some of the aero chaps here could tell us if this is feasable.

EDIT: If nobody has, I'm coining 'DRS-duct'

[i70q7m7ghw]

I am afraid you are seeing ghosts on that photo. It's an optical illusion from the CF layout which form a recess, containing the brake cylinders and tanks.
IMHO

Agreed. There would have to be a way for air to get from these supposed tubes, to the FW pylons, and there isn't.

I don't believe so, I reckon the flat surface helps form a sealed cavity in the nose cone, which is used as part of the pressure switching system that makes the f-duct work.

I think it's very very unlikely they are ducting airflow all the way to the front of the car to blow the front wing, the DRS-duct could only be used as a pressure based switch.