Ferrari F14T

[miguelalvesreis]

On the contrary, a silent gear change implies illegal technology is in use such as CVT. We wouldn't want to get excited about something like that if it wasn't true.

What are you on about? Upshifts have been silent for a long time via the seamless shift. It is quite possible that this has been extended to downshifts.[/quote][/quote]

No they haven't. There is still minimum shift time imposed by the fia and its perfectly noticeable on the telly during a race.[/quote]

Why seamless downshift implies illegal technology?
I think, above all, that the 1st thing to try to ascertain is if it is really seamless or if it just sounds like that.
One problem likely to arise with high torque engines during downshifting is the likelihood of locking the transmission wheels. One way of reducing that likeliness is to do a tip toe, revving up the engine. This is certainly something that everyone is doing thru engine mapping. Maybe SF just decided that they could do it thru the ers.
Would that be illegal?

On the other side, if they decidded to really go seamless, and having the next gear engaged, would it be deemed illegal even if they only have 1 clutch?

Nevertheless, i believe that more than time gaining on the shifts (that are already really fast), teams are trying to avoid the locking and all those torque peaks associated with downshifting that could turn the rear unstable during braking. They achieve the same effect without the need to go really seamless.

And i know the latest generation of seamless gearboxes was already almost as light as a no seamless one but, this year, kilos count a lot!

Just my 2 cents on it

[langwadt]

On the contrary, a silent gear change implies illegal technology is in use such as CVT. We wouldn't want to get excited about something like that if it wasn't true.

What are you on about? Upshifts have been silent for a long time via the seamless shift. It is quite possible that this has been extended to downshifts.[/quote][/quote]

No they haven't. There is still minimum shift time imposed by the fia and its perfectly noticeable on the telly during a race.[/quote]

I only see a maximum shift time in the regulations 300ms down, 200ms up

[charlex]

[/quote]

I only see a maximum shift time in the regulations 300ms down, 200ms up[/quote]
300- 200ms? a quarter of a second?

[PhillipM]

Yes, a maximum, to stop try exhaust blowing solutions mid-change.

[eyalynf1]

On the gearbox issue, I think that they may be taking it out of the complex rear brake by wire control loop. If they could put the mguk in place of the gearbox under braking, it could recover energy more efficiently. Engine speed would decrease according to the fixed ratio linking it to the mguk, and the mguk would apply both engine and rear wheel braking. This would eliminate the stepwise reduction of engine speed and overun that we are used to. Also might save fuel.

So this would be similar to Honda's IMA setup on its roadcar hybrids, where the mguk take the place of the convetional clutch. The mguk becomes like the torque converter in an automatic transmission.

[stefan_]

A good view of the display Ferrari are using on the steering wheel.


via @RealSteRumbelow

[zioture]

The pull rod on the ferrari does not seem to have aerodynamic advantages, compared to that of Mercedes AMG.
I think the push rod Mercedes is better than ferrari less drag.
Why Ferrari has chosen ul pull-rod then?

[hollowBallistix]

Doesn't that suspension layout mean they have the most clearance on the underside of the tub ? and considering this is the philosophy they have followed for the past 3 years, so why change if it have no negative impact to the air flow around this area ?

[rscsr]

http://www.newsf1.it/wp-content/uploads ... sh_rod.jpg
The pull rod on the ferrari does not seem to have aerodynamic advantages, compared to that of Mercedes AMG.
I think the push rod Mercedes is better than ferrari less drag.
Why Ferrari has chosen ul pull-rod then?

I guess that they figured, that they could mount the heavy parts lower. Although they need to strengthen the upper wishbones (which should be modest, since CFRP has a low specific young-modulus), it should improve the height of the cog. (Although this means a harder time adjusting the suspension)

[Crabbia]

http://www.newsf1.it/wp-content/uploads ... sh_rod.jpg
The pull rod on the ferrari does not seem to have aerodynamic advantages, compared to that of Mercedes AMG.
I think the push rod Mercedes is better than ferrari less drag.
Why Ferrari has chosen ul pull-rod then?

The aerodynamic advantage you are seeing there is that the MB has its steering rod directly behind the upper front wishbone. This gives them far less frontal area reducing drag. Ferrari's is exposed. advantage BM.

Ferrari's lower wish bones mount much higher on the tub side. In the photo compare were the lower wishbones attach between the two cars (use the camera housing as a reference). This gives the Ferrari much cleaner air under the tub. Advantage Ferrari.

The pull rod is smaller in length than the push rod. This means that there is less of a frontal area reducing drag, Small advantage Ferrari.

It all depends on how the teams weighed up those advantages and how those advantages enhance what ever else they have downstream.

[el-Magico]

http://www.newsf1.it/wp-content/uploads ... sh_rod.jpg
The pull rod on the ferrari does not seem to have aerodynamic advantages, compared to that of Mercedes AMG.
I think the push rod Mercedes is better than ferrari less drag.
Why Ferrari has chosen ul pull-rod then?

The Ferrari has more space under the rods, than the Mercedes..
perhaps there lays an advantage as well?

[Alexgtt]

Are they using something like the slipper clutches they use in Motogp, which smooth out the down changes to stop rear locking into corners? A must on the high power bikes but maybe they found an advantage?

[miguelalvesreis]

Are they using something like the slipper clutches they use in Motogp, which smooth out the down changes to stop rear locking into corners? A must on the high power bikes but maybe they found an advantage?

I would believe that with the really high torque produced by this engines, a slip clutch would be inadvisable but, I'm often wrong

[321apex]

The aerodynamic advantage you are seeing there is that the MB has its steering rod directly behind the upper front wishbone. This gives them far less frontal area reducing drag. Ferrari's is exposed. advantage BM.

Ferrari's lower wish bones mount much higher on the tub side. In the photo compare were the lower wishbones attach between the two cars (use the camera housing as a reference). This gives the Ferrari much cleaner air under the tub. Advantage Ferrari.

The pull rod is smaller in length than the push rod. This means that there is less of a frontal area reducing drag, Small advantage Ferrari.

It all depends on how the teams weighed up those advantages and how those advantages enhance what ever else they have downstream.

Well said.
I would just add, that when the front wheel jounces up, the front loaded/outside wheel track increases due to the wishbone angles. This may be a small advantage causing an instant decrease in oversteer, just to borrow the front/rear track width effects from my karting days.

[F1.Ru]

http://www.newsf1.it/wp-content/uploads ... sh_rod.jpg
The pull rod on the ferrari does not seem to have aerodynamic advantages, compared to that of Mercedes AMG.
I think the push rod Mercedes is better than ferrari less drag.
Why Ferrari has chosen ul pull-rod then?

The aerodynamic advantage you are seeing there is that the MB has its steering rod directly behind the upper front wishbone. This gives them far less frontal area reducing drag. Ferrari's is exposed. advantage BM.

Ferrari's lower wish bones mount much higher on the tub side. In the photo compare were the lower wishbones attach between the two cars (use the camera housing as a reference). This gives the Ferrari much cleaner air under the tub. Advantage Ferrari.

The pull rod is smaller in length than the push rod. This means that there is less of a frontal area reducing drag, Small advantage Ferrari.

It all depends on how the teams weighed up those advantages and how those advantages enhance what ever else they have downstream.

Another advantages of Ferrari's pull rod arrangement is it act as a flow conditioner & vortex generator and thus it direct turbulent air towards radiators with more force than normal push rod. And as Ferrari is pretty much familiar with this layout so they can develop their car without worrying about front suspension wake and their behavior on the overall car.