Red Bull RB10 Renault

[tinvek]

When the car runs at full power of 15k RPM and achieves peak torque, for a long duration is when we know if the problems of overheating are conquered or not. For now, there are problems of varying degree and various nature are present.

even more likely is that we'll find out if anyone still has problems when they've been running in a race for 10 laps at full power and torque and then spend 5 laps behind a safety car

[Juzh]

When the car runs at full power of 15k RPM and achieves peak torque, for a long duration is when we know if the problems of overheating are conquered or not. For now, there are problems of varying degree and various nature are present.

Max power is not at 15k rpm and no one will run 15k rpm unless 8th gear where they'll need those revs. Just saying..

[lio007]

Sebastian Vettel said in an Interview that they will drive with a revised RB10. Outside the car would look like the same as in winter testing. But under the skin they did a lot of changes.

http://www.speedweek.com/formel1/news/5 ... -mehr.html
http://www.motorsport-magazin.com/forme ... -den-rb10/

[ringo]

When the car runs at full power of 15k RPM and achieves peak torque, for a long duration is when we know if the problems of overheating are conquered or not. For now, there are problems of varying degree and various nature are present.

Max power is not at 15k rpm and no one will run 15k rpm unless 8th gear where they'll need those revs. Just saying..

I think 15000 rpm will be used in some turns, especially the longer lasting ones.

[dans79]

"nobody is claiming they have heat problems"

So when Red Bull cuts holes in the body work with a saw, what do they say it is for?

MGU H heat sinks.

Just because it's not the ICE, doesn't mean it's not a cooling problem.

[Robbobnob]

When the car runs at full power of 15k RPM and achieves peak torque, for a long duration is when we know if the problems of overheating are conquered or not. For now, there are problems of varying degree and various nature are present.

Max power is not at 15k rpm and no one will run 15k rpm unless 8th gear where they'll need those revs. Just saying..

I think 15000 rpm will be used in some turns, especially the longer lasting ones.

Yes but only the turns with elliptical profiles.

But in reality, the only reason not to run up to the peak power output and shift up would be because they are in the highest ratio. Speeds have already been in excess of 330 kph, with teams indicating we could see close to 400 kph this season it seems highly unlikely that teams will be running their cars at top speed through corners. Particularly given that at the end of the majority of the straights in F1 is a hair pin or 'chicken'.

[BobbyT]

The RB10 will have no heating problems on race day at Albert Park assuming the weather forecast is correct.

A daytime max of 16 degrees Celsius with SSW winds (blowing off the Southern Ocean form Antarctica) means that 5pm local time will be significantly less, and 29mm of rain throughout the day.

We may not even have a race (think qualifying last year at Albert Park)...

http://www.weather.com.au/vic/melbourne

[MatthiasDS]

But in reality, the only reason not to run up to the peak power output and shift up would be because they are in the highest ratio.

In qualification: yes.
In races however, they're going to have to save fuel. Not running up to peak power would be an efficient way to save fuel and still go reasonably fast as these new cars have a lot more torque/power lower in the rev range, lowering the impact of shifting sooner.

[dxpetrov]

Why nobody reacted to the fact that RB10 had no "cooling" holes on last day of testing and further confirmations from CH that those issues had been solved. Why do we still talk about this?
A'll the remaining issues are turbo, traction and software related....

[Thunder]

As long as Renault sorts out their Problems i expect a strong RedBull in OZ. As much as i would like to see other Teams at the Front, never underestimate the Money and Adrian Newey.

[Coefficient]

Why nobody reacted to the fact that RB10 had no "cooling" holes on last day of testing and further confirmations from CH that those issues had been solved. Why do we still talk about this?
A'll the remaining issues are turbo, traction and software related....

Yes, I think if people are hoping Red Bull are heading for serious problems causing poor race performance you're in for a disappointment. I suspect they will be just fine come Sunday. Maybe not leading from the front immediately but they will show well enough to make it obvious that race winning performance is in the post. Write them off at your peril all ye nay sayers!!

[dans79]

what is it with someone of you, you get all defensive or passive aggressive if anyone even suggests it's a possibility RBR won't be at the very tip of the spear.

up until the last day of testing they had cooling problems with the car. Regardless of what some here will trumpet anytime a car has to stop because something is to hot to function properly it's a cooling problem. They might be able to fix the problem in any of number of ways, but RBR has yet to prove that software changes alone will fix the issue. Just because you make a change and then are able put in an ok number of laps, doesn't mean that fix is the a silver bullet. They could easily have a failure in race conditions.

They have yet to put in a fast lap, they have yet to Finnish a race simulation, they have yet to put a lot of millage on components, and i can't see how they could have managed to get any set-up work done with the number of issues they had. The car might be quick, but they have a lot of work to do to prove it to the world. I don't think they will be cruising around with Catarahm, but i don't think they are going to have podium capability for a lot of races unless others have problems.

[skwdenyer]

"...attempting to tune the displacement behaviour and they were experiencing too much which caused aggressive heating."

Working to grasp what's happening here.

What does "attempting to tune the displacement behaviour" mean?

Was the heat in the tray you mentioned from the oscillations generated by the t-tray acoustically resonating like a (for example) clarinet reed, thus causing heat build up from the bending metal? The drill tuning holes remind me of vibraphone bars which sometimes are tuned by drilling holes in the underside -- to change the resonant frequency of the bar.

Do heat pockets (you said they did not want these) cause distortion of the metal and/or distortion of air flow (expansion)?

I was more referring to heat generated by friction from the road surface. If the maximum displacement of the t-tray downwards was too large then there would be interference with the track.

Yes that is essentially what Red Bull are doing, tuning the mass displacement to change the resonant frequency and response at the resonance frequency by using holes and most likely different weighted constructions.

I wouldn't expect a significant heat generation by the resonance, not below 2000 Hz at least.

It is only my guess based on what I have seen, but perhaps Red Bull use the vibrations to trip the bounday layer on the underside of the plank?
From what I am seeing, Im not expecting any significant upwards displacement, though one would expect it to be greater than the 5 mm requirement by the FIA

Ah-ha, thanks for that. Interesting.

[basti313]

what is it with someone of you, you get all defensive or passive aggressive if anyone even suggests it's a possibility RBR won't be at the very tip of the spear.

Who suggested that?
I only see harsh reactions on people repeating technical nonsense without any proof or at least a substantiated explanation.

anytime a car has to stop because something is to hot to function properly it's a cooling problem

It is completely useless to discuss about cooling issues or cars stopping on the track on this basis...

[dans79]

It is completely useless to discuss about cooling issues or cars stopping on the track on this basis...

I think you just answered your own question!