Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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Harsha
Harsha
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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giantfan10 wrote:
Harsha wrote:
SiLo wrote:The gap should diminish, it's the law of diminishing returns.
The Gap will reduce but it wont diminish that quickly atleast not before 2015 end considering in 2016 big rule changes in engine development was forced to stop Mercs.
there were no rule changes forced to stop mercedes...get your facts right
the reality is this... right now a UNANIMOUS vote is needed to change any of the the engine freeze rules
in 2016 a MAJORITY vote is needed to change any of the Pu freeze rules
that was all agreed to before the beginning of the 2014 season.
what Renault and Ferrari are saying is this: we want to be able to modify our engines to a limited extent during the season along with the almost 50 percent we are already allowed to modify the engine in the offseason because the way it is now is assinine at best.Mercedes of course want no part of losing their obvious advantage and said no.
Ferrari and Renault replied well when 2016 comes around we will have the votes to completely do away with ANY restrictions on Pu develpment for that season and reignite an engine war..
I think i didn't mention it specifically
Considering in 2016 is what i used as i know all this things and kept a eagle eye on how ferrari and renault was going to approach 2015 and honda has two scenarios
1. If Honda indeed built a mega PU then Merc will start crying
2. If Honda couldn't built it they will join renault and ferrari to develop it

Harsha
Harsha
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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laMirabeau wrote:
Harsha wrote:
SiLo wrote:The gap should diminish, it's the law of diminishing returns.
The Gap will reduce but it wont diminish that quickly atleast not before 2015 end considering in 2016 big rule changes in engine development was forced to stop Mercs.
Long time lurker and first post. Please be nice to me. :)

As the rules for engine freezing goes, the opportunity to do any modification to MERCEDES, RENAULT and FERRARI is only that they can change around 50% for this year (via tokens, not sure how exactly that works).
Is that sufficient enough for RENAULT AND FERRARI to close the current gap to MERCEDES?
If Mercedes indeed, like the rumors are flowing, gain more for next year, what is the opportunity for others to catch up?
I believe some of these are the questions, which is prompting other manufacturers to fight and get a free hand for development.
The law of diminishing returns would naturally apply after most of the areas of development are exhausted and not at the beginning of a process.
This is what i know so far about engine details and you are right though thats why i said its not possible to catch Mercedes by any team
For 2015, in theory yes 95% of the power unit can be develop (the other parts consisting of ~5% is permanently frozen). However, that doesn't mean they can change 95% of the power unit. There is a limit to the number of parts you can actually change. The power unit is divided into "tokens", and for 2015, 61 tokens are available for changes. However, teams are given the credit of 32 tokens only. That means, of the 61 token worth of parts that you are allowed to change, you can only choose 32 of them to be changed. And these changes must be done before February. After that, engine development is not allowed for the rest of 2015.

What Renault and Ferrari want for 2015, is to change the rules so that if you do not spend all 32 token before February, you are allowed a second window to use up to 13 token and make changes to the PU in July. But to change the rules in 2015, everyone must agree to the changes. If someone is against it, then the rules cannot be changed.

Mercedes is against this. They then offered a compromise which is they will agree to the changes if the tokens allow in July is much lesser than what Ferrari and Renault are asking for. Ferrari and Renault then rejected that offer, and threaten that if Mercedes do not accept their proposal for 2015, then in 2016 they will blow open all development restriction. In 2016, somehow the agreement is that only a majority of the teams need to agree on rule changes. That means for 2016, they no longer need Merc agreement to change the rules.

That's probably where you hear about engine unfreeze in 2016. At the moment, it is just a threat against Mercedes if they do not agree to 2015 proposal.

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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Horner said, thankfully the 42 tokens are more than enough to change the parts that really matter!
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Crucial_Xtreme
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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AMuS has posted in pictures, the updates the W05 received throughout the year.


http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 42508.html

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Morteza
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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Video - technical review: Mercedes F1 W05 Hybrid
http://www.formula1.com/news/technical/2014/0/1247.html
"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

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Shrieker
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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F1 Steering Wheels - Lewis Hamilton vs Nico Rosberg - Analysis

Sorry if this is a repost. Nothing came up on search.
Education is that which allows a nation free, independent, reputable life, and function as a high society; or it condemns it to captivity and poverty.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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Paddy Lowe revisits the W05 Hybrid.

http://f1news.autoroad.cz/technika/4966 ... tak-dobry/

Tranlsated:

Paddy Lowe

"Successful cars can not come from nothing. There is a sequence of building blocks that you need. For two or three years pieced Ross Brawn and Bob Bell team that put together the aerodynamics,"


"In 2012 Mercedes terms of aerodynamics was a great car, very lagged. In 2013 won the qualifying and the race against Red Bull, when the engines played a big difference in performance.

It therefore turned to growing confidence in aerodynamics and that the package for 2014 was a result of this development. We took an earlier understanding and apply it to the new efficiency formula, which offers other opportunities. The result is a huge similarity W04 and W05 cars Hybrid, " continued Lowe.



Nose

"The team examined all kinds of proposals ... but the solution we came up with was the best in terms of aerodynamic numbers. It was quite gratifying to know that it is not only the best looking, but also the best aerodynamically," smiles technical director Mercedes.


"Two or three times we tried to die of crash tests. There are several test points during a test, there are many vibrations. Experiment vibration is noisy, you can then have the result of bad luck. I do not think, however, that the nose was more on the edge in terms of safety than others that have passed the first time. In short, all the measurements did not pass, so we had to adjust a little, " admits Lowe. The third version of the nose team used in Belgium and continued with it until the end of the season.


Suspension and tuned airflow

The reason is again aerodynamics and effort to optimize the flow front sides. "Suspension is today the most defined aerodynamics," confirms Lowe. The team has mastered all the pitfalls of this approach and had no problems with setup or with tire wear or worse drivability.

Rear suspension is related solutions with gear. Cars W04 and W05 Hybrid have it placed in a titanium housing, which is but additionally encapsulated in the carbon container - up thereon are fixing points for suspension. What is it good for?

"One of the characteristics of encapsulation is that it provides greater flexibility in the configuration. There are several reasons why you want things to change. The change camber is probably the greatest that is done. We have several options, but there are not a huge amount," approaching technical director. Housing made ​​of carbon fiber also allows you to change the suspension geometry, without the need to again undergo crash tests back of the car.

Front suspension


Excellent work with tires

"This team has had since 2010 a very bad reputation in how used tires. In 2013 we had a car that was able to winning qualification, we realized but painful shortcomings in endurance tires, " admits Lowe.

"Do this car so we put a lot more effort. When I came here last year, so incredibly impressed me, to what extent do the investing and understand the tires. The team had in the years 2010 - 2012 the misfortune to DNA car tires simply did not fit.

Thanks to this, but the team came up with a much better research and development, with a much better understanding than other teams, and during 2014 a weakness transformed into advantage. In season 2014 we were able to use the tires probably the best in the pit lane, in terms of both performance and also their stamina. "

Mercedes has acquired good knowledge of how the new Pirelli tires work. "It's not so obvious. Cars, and various aspects of the car can be good or bad according luck. There are cars that have won championships, the people, the people around them and jiggled pretend to know everything, but in fact benefited from things around, which did not really understand. They often revolved around the tires.

These cars are so many parameters and thus little opportunity to test them, so many of these parameters are transferred from one year to another. They become part of the DNA of the car. Tyres can win or lose championships, and so it is already 20 to 30 years.

They are the most complex part of the car. This is because they are just so weird dynamic and difficult to accurately understand. Recently, there was one car that was able to withstand the tires very long time, and sufficed with one stop less than others. When you have but to ask the engineers failed to tell you exactly why it has such a property, " Lowe surprising stories from the paddock.

mercedes - rear suspension


Fric, weight loss, and the secret joy of changes

"His removal has slowed to some extent all but difficult to assess to what extent. It could affect us more than others, but it is not so clear. I think that at least suffered by Williams, but perhaps equally just simply improve," believes Lowe .

A complex system required under its body hardware and its removal had unexpected consequences: "They found things that we could put after removing his place in the side, so we take full advantage, but the biggest thing was losing weight. All the teams had little secret happy that it happened, because it came the mass relief - until then in this area was very tense. "

"The balance represented a huge challenge. It's hard to say who suffered the most. It was the hardest for at least the last decade. We were able to meet a car but get under the limit and in the context of mass distribution. But it's not always so easy.

You can always remove something from the car, but you'd better not let them in. We had to carefully guard against a lot of parts and carry out intensive and detailed predictions weight than before. Regarding accuracy, we climbed to several kilograms, because there are always things that become harder or missing. We are much closer than ever before, " says Lowe.

Mercedes despite stable rules prepares an entirely new car W06
Because this rule does not change much (adjusted the tip of the nose and increased minimum weight to 702 kg), it is expected that a new Mercedes car a lot of parts transferred. According to the technical director, however, comes with an entirely new single-seater.

"She did not transmit directly, but a large part of the car rework, so to do that. It comes to weight savings, improved reliability and maintenance. Changing the rules on the nose also aerodynamically some things will change.

We could bring things such as the gearbox, but if we did, we would simply let the performance on the table, so the design will improve. I have a theory that if you look at two years old F1 car, so it looks agriculturally.

Now we are talking about W05, its elegance and how it is the best car we've seen. But as soon as we finish W07, then look at this car will look like on sophistication and outdated. This is Formula 1, " he continues.

Successor W06 will be a much better car: "You can not determine exactly why, but there it is - all those engineers here, their spirit of innovation and pushing the boundaries is why Mercedes is still more sophisticated and better car than the W05."

It will therefore dominance Silver Arrows continue this year? And it will do what it failed W05 - even record the Lotus 72 at number twenty victories? Smarter we Nov. 29, when the season ends Grand Prix of Abu Dhabi (this time scoring normally again, not twice, as was the case last year).
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BanMeToo
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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Woah! He finally gave Brawn some credit :wink:

NewtonMeter
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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Thanks for that Mr. PlatinumZealot. Interesting stuff.
Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool...

fernando12
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W05

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