2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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jjn9128
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:10 pm
sosic2121 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:00 pm
RZS10 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 11:18 am


?

https://i.imgur.com/XrQlbMu.png
=D> :lol:
Maybe also a water pit
And a jump through a flaming hoop?
Bernie’s sprinkler idea should be revisited
#aerogandalf
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RZS10
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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214270 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:18 pm
Edax wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 11:09 am
214270 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 10:43 am
Still haven’t caught up on the race; seems like I shouldn’t even bother.

I believe I read a few years ago there was a substantial reclamation project in prelim at Monaco? I don’t know whether that’s been shelved or not as there was a possibility of extending the track into new areas which might save racing at this venue. Short of a complete revamp of the weekend, I don’t see how else to save the Monaco GP.
I think you are right that there was an idea to extend the track on a land reclamation (portier cove). But if I look at the current construction plans it does not look like it can accommodate track.
Can you link to it pls?, I’d like to read up on it. Thanks
There was never anything more than "maybe we could extend the circuit onto Le Portier"

From a 2015 Forbes article:
The most exciting development is for the racing fraternity of Formula One, utilizing the new land to create a new section of track, leading from the downhill Portier to a new section with wide road and a tight hairpin, creating an overtaking spot. The track would then rejoin the original circuit just before the tunnel, thus cutting the speed at which cars go through and reducing the dangers of the confined area.
From 2018 in Forbes quoting Prince Albert II:
We always look, every once in a while, at different possibilities of extending the track, and certainly something to think about is that we are building the new land extension. There are no plans or anything yet, it is just in the back of all of our minds — people in the Automobile Club but also in the government — that there could be. I am not saying that it will happen necessarily, but at some point we are going to put our minds together and say, how can we not only improve this, but how can we make it a little more exciting by maybe changing the course slightly? We haven’t gone beyond this simple statement of an idea — something that is in the back of our minds.
jjn9128 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:32 pm
El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:10 pm
sosic2121 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:00 pm

=D> :lol:
Maybe also a water pit
And a jump through a flaming hoop?
Bernie’s sprinkler idea should be revisited
Route some of the track "into" the water, make it alternate randomly between being submerged by like 2 cm and just being wet - take F1 aquaplaning to a whole new level.

I'm collecting all the ideas and will shoot the FIA/Liberty and the Prince a mail with some drawings/photoshops :^)

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Big Tea
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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I don't know that Mercedes will be that bothered about this. I think the only part they will not like is the wheel problem that comes over as a Mercedes fail.

Yes, Lewis is peeved and Woolf is peeved, but look at the big picture and see the extra attraction for the rest of the season.
Some have been complains about the Mercedes steamroller and a forgone conclusion with the fastest car, now they can point at someone else leading the title chase and having to pull the cherry out.

There is only one thing worse than bad publicity, and that's no publicity. It is the equivalent to a soap tv hanger when you think the hero is a goner and you have to be sure to see the following episodes although you know he will win by the end
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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jjn9128
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:45 pm
I don't know that Mercedes will be that bothered about this. I think the only part they will not like is the wheel problem that comes over as a Mercedes fail.

Yes, Lewis is peeved and Woolf is peeved, but look at the big picture and see the extra attraction for the rest of the season.
Some have been complains about the Mercedes steamroller and a forgone conclusion with the fastest car, now they can point at someone else leading the title chase and having to pull the cherry out.

There is only one thing worse than bad publicity, and that's no publicity. It is the equivalent to a soap tv hanger when you think the hero is a goner and you have to be sure to see the following episodes although you know he will win by the end
Mercedes maybe. But the mechanics might be affected (probably not from just 1 weekend in the past year or two). You bust your ass and the star guy is questioning you. There’s a reason Piquet was preferred to Mansell, and why Schumacher is still held in such high regard by people he worked with.
#aerogandalf
"There is one big friend. It is downforce. And once you have this it’s a big mate and it’s helping a lot." Robert Kubica

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Big Tea
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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jjn9128 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:49 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:45 pm
I don't know that Mercedes will be that bothered about this. I think the only part they will not like is the wheel problem that comes over as a Mercedes fail.

Yes, Lewis is peeved and Woolf is peeved, but look at the big picture and see the extra attraction for the rest of the season.
Some have been complains about the Mercedes steamroller and a forgone conclusion with the fastest car, now they can point at someone else leading the title chase and having to pull the cherry out.

There is only one thing worse than bad publicity, and that's no publicity. It is the equivalent to a soap tv hanger when you think the hero is a goner and you have to be sure to see the following episodes although you know he will win by the end
Mercedes maybe. But the mechanics might be affected (probably not from just 1 weekend in the past year or two). You bust your ass and the star guy is questioning you. There’s a reason Piquet was preferred to Mansell, and why Schumacher is still held in such high regard by people he worked with.
I mean those in the board room rather than those at the track. But even those at the track need a low to apricate the highs.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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El Scorchio
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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jjn9128 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:32 pm
El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:10 pm
sosic2121 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:00 pm

=D> :lol:
Maybe also a water pit
And a jump through a flaming hoop?
Bernie’s sprinkler idea should be revisited
Now THAT would spice things up. Just at the exit of the tunnel?!

aral
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Could we please have less of the Hamilton v Rosberg upbringing? It has no relevance to a thread about the Monaco GP.

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Big Tea
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:53 pm
jjn9128 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:32 pm
El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:10 pm


And a jump through a flaming hoop?
Bernie’s sprinkler idea should be revisited
Now THAT would spice things up. Just at the exit of the tunnel?!
Or random power cuts to the tunnel lights.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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El Scorchio
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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RZS10 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:33 pm
214270 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:18 pm
Edax wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 11:09 am

I think you are right that there was an idea to extend the track on a land reclamation (portier cove). But if I look at the current construction plans it does not look like it can accommodate track.
Can you link to it pls?, I’d like to read up on it. Thanks
There was never anything more than "maybe we could extend the circuit onto Le Portier"

From a 2015 Forbes article:
The most exciting development is for the racing fraternity of Formula One, utilizing the new land to create a new section of track, leading from the downhill Portier to a new section with wide road and a tight hairpin, creating an overtaking spot. The track would then rejoin the original circuit just before the tunnel, thus cutting the speed at which cars go through and reducing the dangers of the confined area.
From 2018 in Forbes quoting Prince Albert II:
We always look, every once in a while, at different possibilities of extending the track, and certainly something to think about is that we are building the new land extension. There are no plans or anything yet, it is just in the back of all of our minds — people in the Automobile Club but also in the government — that there could be. I am not saying that it will happen necessarily, but at some point we are going to put our minds together and say, how can we not only improve this, but how can we make it a little more exciting by maybe changing the course slightly? We haven’t gone beyond this simple statement of an idea — something that is in the back of our minds.
jjn9128 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:32 pm
El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:10 pm


And a jump through a flaming hoop?
Bernie’s sprinkler idea should be revisited
Route some of the track "into" the water, make it alternate randomly between being submerged by like 2 cm and just being wet - take F1 aquaplaning to a whole new level.

I'm collecting all the ideas and will shoot the FIA/Liberty and the Prince a mail with some drawings/photoshops :^)
They just need to manufacture ONE point on the circuit where a car reasonably faster than the one in front of it can have a good go at an overtake. I think that would breathe a whole new heap of life into it as a race. There would still be the great challenge of following closely enough over the rest of the lap to set yourself up for it.

Easier said than done at Monaco, though. There just isn't the opportunity to make a straight long enough or straight enough. Would removing the nouvelle chicane have any positive effect whatsoever? (If it's even possible)

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RZS10
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Taking inspiration from miniature golf:
Image

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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jjn9128 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:49 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:45 pm
I don't know that Mercedes will be that bothered about this. I think the only part they will not like is the wheel problem that comes over as a Mercedes fail.

Yes, Lewis is peeved and Woolf is peeved, but look at the big picture and see the extra attraction for the rest of the season.
Some have been complains about the Mercedes steamroller and a forgone conclusion with the fastest car, now they can point at someone else leading the title chase and having to pull the cherry out.

There is only one thing worse than bad publicity, and that's no publicity. It is the equivalent to a soap tv hanger when you think the hero is a goner and you have to be sure to see the following episodes although you know he will win by the end
Mercedes maybe. But the mechanics might be affected (probably not from just 1 weekend in the past year or two). You bust your ass and the star guy is questioning you. There’s a reason Piquet was preferred to Mansell, and why Schumacher is still held in such high regard by people he worked with.
He's not having a dig at the mechanics. He's having a dig at the prat perch people. As said in the race , why did they have him protect his tyres and then run him short? Having protected his tyres, it would have made more sense to go long. That sort of thing.

Yes, it would have been nice and friendly to say "the team did a great job but it didn't work out this weekend", but sometimes humans prove that they're not perfect. Some will pick up on that and use it as the basis for character assassination (see posts by some others on this forum). I guess it's a side effect of the corporate speak drivers that populate the grid these days. Kimi is the last of the old school "it was crap, what else to say?" drivers. With modern drivers the likes of Hamilton and all the rest, we get to hear the same PR guff ad nauseum because that's the name of the game these days. So when the mask slips, it's "OMG!" for some people.

I'm sure the odd slight is forgotten when the win bonuses are paid out. :lol:
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

i70q7m7ghw
i70q7m7ghw
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Schuttelberg wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 8:15 am
The journalist isn't creating any drama. May be you need to view it with more balance. When asked if there were any learnings he clearly says they're all for the team and none for him.

Let's just say that the team did ask him to go a certain route with set up, then one has to say that over the past eight years Mercedes must have done that often? How often have they been right and got Lewis a win?

You win and lose as a team. In his case, it's often this narrative that when they win it's a team effort but when they lose its just the team. It doesn't work like that. He could have won in Imola had he not put it in the kitty litter. He could have qualified better here like his team mate showed. Also, while Max is 23 and much much more raw, he conducted himself very well with Charles being in the wall. I can show you how Lewis has reacted at the same venue when he couldn't complete a lap against his championship rival?

Some people cannot accept losing and that is fine. The issue at hand is the choice of convenience where all great things are mostly down to him but he isn't to blame when it goes pear shaped. For a seven times world champion to say that about a team that has given him a championship winning car every year bar one is pretty low and shallow as far as I am concerned.
I've watched all of the interviews for balance, and overall his tone is that as a team they didn't perform this weekend, and he is quite clearly including his own performance in that statement. The "questions" from Dutch TV are obviously trying to provoke a response and they are absolutely about drama, that's what they want as it makes for good TV. The first few questions aren't even questions, just statements about how bad Hamilton's weekend has been, if that's not creating drama what is? They were trying to ruffle his feathers, and they succeeded it seems.

But hey, if you want to take some fairly short answers he provided in response to an interview from Dutch TV (the nationality of his rival) which was clearly intended to provoke a response from him and turn it in to a narrative of "not a team player", go for it :wtf:

I would say Lewis certainly got a taste of his own medicine, he was making some fairly silly comments in the media during the weekend clearly trying to play some mind games with Max. After having a disaster of a weekend, very quickly it's all turned back on him.
Last edited by i70q7m7ghw on Mon May 24, 2021 1:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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NathanOlder
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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jjn9128 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:49 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:45 pm
I don't know that Mercedes will be that bothered about this. I think the only part they will not like is the wheel problem that comes over as a Mercedes fail.

Yes, Lewis is peeved and Woolf is peeved, but look at the big picture and see the extra attraction for the rest of the season.
Some have been complains about the Mercedes steamroller and a forgone conclusion with the fastest car, now they can point at someone else leading the title chase and having to pull the cherry out.

There is only one thing worse than bad publicity, and that's no publicity. It is the equivalent to a soap tv hanger when you think the hero is a goner and you have to be sure to see the following episodes although you know he will win by the end
Mercedes maybe. But the mechanics might be affected (probably not from just 1 weekend in the past year or two). You bust your ass and the star guy is questioning you. There’s a reason Piquet was preferred to Mansell, and why Schumacher is still held in such high regard by people he worked with.
I missed him have a dig at the mechanics ? Or have you just made that bit up ? Of all the Autobiographies I have read, I havent found anyone to speak badly of Lewis. Brawn, Newey, Priestly , Jenson, Mark Hughes, Damon etc have all said how well Lewis works with his team and is a nice guy around the paddock. I respect their opinions and believe they have no reason to lie. Wasn't Lewis just annoyed with the setup direction that went against what he suggested, and the race strategy was flipped on its head at the last second and it failed badly.
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:05 pm
RZS10 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:33 pm
214270 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:18 pm


Can you link to it pls?, I’d like to read up on it. Thanks
There was never anything more than "maybe we could extend the circuit onto Le Portier"

From a 2015 Forbes article:
The most exciting development is for the racing fraternity of Formula One, utilizing the new land to create a new section of track, leading from the downhill Portier to a new section with wide road and a tight hairpin, creating an overtaking spot. The track would then rejoin the original circuit just before the tunnel, thus cutting the speed at which cars go through and reducing the dangers of the confined area.
From 2018 in Forbes quoting Prince Albert II:
We always look, every once in a while, at different possibilities of extending the track, and certainly something to think about is that we are building the new land extension. There are no plans or anything yet, it is just in the back of all of our minds — people in the Automobile Club but also in the government — that there could be. I am not saying that it will happen necessarily, but at some point we are going to put our minds together and say, how can we not only improve this, but how can we make it a little more exciting by maybe changing the course slightly? We haven’t gone beyond this simple statement of an idea — something that is in the back of our minds.
jjn9128 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:32 pm

Bernie’s sprinkler idea should be revisited
Route some of the track "into" the water, make it alternate randomly between being submerged by like 2 cm and just being wet - take F1 aquaplaning to a whole new level.

I'm collecting all the ideas and will shoot the FIA/Liberty and the Prince a mail with some drawings/photoshops :^)
They just need to manufacture ONE point on the circuit where a car reasonably faster than the one in front of it can have a good go at an overtake. I think that would breathe a whole new heap of life into it as a race. There would still be the great challenge of following closely enough over the rest of the lap to set yourself up for it.

Easier said than done at Monaco, though. There just isn't the opportunity to make a straight long enough or straight enough. Would removing the nouvelle chicane have any positive effect whatsoever? (If it's even possible)
From satellite view there are other roads that could be used. Monaco is bigger than just the waterfront area where the current track is.

The Portier Cove land reclamation doesn’t seem large enough to provide a decent section for overtaking unfortunately.

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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:05 pm

They just need to manufacture ONE point on the circuit where a car reasonably faster than the one in front of it can have a good go at an overtake. I think that would breathe a whole new heap of life into it as a race. There would still be the great challenge of following closely enough over the rest of the lap to set yourself up for it.

Easier said than done at Monaco, though. There just isn't the opportunity to make a straight long enough or straight enough. Would removing the nouvelle chicane have any positive effect whatsoever? (If it's even possible)
The only place would be to extend the run from the tunnel. Scrap the chicane and move it further along the Ave JF Kennedy.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.7370289 ... 312!8i6656

Probably need to take out a couple of trees too. It wouldn't be much extra straight but it might work. It would be very narrow, however so extremely easy to block by just driving near the middle of the track. That could be solved by removing all of the trees along there but that's probably not going to go down well with the locals. It also would make Tabac a much slower corner and affect the speed in to the swimming pool complex.

Other than that, you'd need to totally change the circuit and go driving around the streets away from the water front.

The reality is that F1 doesn't work at Monaco in terms of racing. Great to see the cars being hustled in qualifying (no one argues with that, I'm sure), but the race is usually dull, dull, dull.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"