Red Bull RB8 Renault

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter does not belong here.
User avatar
Gridlock
30
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 3:14 am

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

#58

aral
aral
26
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:49 pm

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

Why do posters keep posting old photos of past cars?

Richard
Richard
Moderator
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:41 pm
Location: UK

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

CottrellGP wrote:If anyone is interested i have some close up pics of the RB8 from the Autosport show, and a shot of inside the tunnel on sidepods, if you would like me to share then just let me know. Im not gonna upload them now because i know there from an earlier spec car and maybe useless.
They sound interesting so please do post them in the right thread, or start a thread saying "Which RB car is this?" and I'll move it to the right place once it has been identified.

User avatar
raymondu999
54
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:31 am

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

http://formula-one.speedtv.com/article/ ... 012-start/
Adrian Newey has confirmed reports an eleventh-hour ban by the FIA was a serious setback to Red Bull's 2012 preparations.

It emerged in recent days that, just as the reigning champions were preparing to test debut the ultimately title-winning RB8, F1's governing body banned Newey's solution to the new blown exhaust clampdown.

"It set us back further than we thought," Briton Newey told Germany's Auto Motor und Sport.

"When we looked at the new rules, we thought the effects would be less severe, especially because we thought we could compensate well."

However, the FIA said Red Bull could not use its proposed 2012 exhaust solution.

"So because of the lack of time, we went to the first test with a conventional exhaust in the engine cowling," said Newey. Frantic work behind the scenes then began on a so-called 'Coanda' solution.

He revealed that the banned 2012 solution was a sophisticated sort of rear brake duct that absorbed exhaust gases.

"There was a loophole in the rules for the area behind the rear suspension," said designer Newey. "So you could have something that collects the gases and transports them where you want them."

The FIA quickly closed the loophole, leaving Red Bull scrambling for balance at the start of 2012.

"It was hard to find a balance, yes," Newey confirmed. "We had understeer, oversteer, often booth simultaneously."

He says often that the FIA's constant crusade against innovation is frustrating.

"We should be careful that the rules don't restrict the inventive spirit. The beauty of Formula One is the struggle of man against man but also machine against machine.

"There is something for every interest. The more stringent the rules are, the faster we move towards 'GP1'. Do we want that?

"I'm surprised how many of my colleagues at the meetings of the technical working group make the case for more restrictions. It's as if we are letting the turkeys vote for Christmas."
失败者找理由,成功者找方法

User avatar
turbof1
Moderator
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:36 pm
Location: MountDoom CFD Matrix

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

"So you could have something that collects the gases and transports them where you want them."
Interesting. If I am correct, there has to be within a certain distance and radius of the exhaust exit, no bodywork. Could they have found a potentional loophole which could have allowed it anyway? And what do they mean with "absorbing"? Just a channel or something different?
#AeroFrodo

User avatar
raymondu999
54
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:31 am

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

I read somewhere (I think in an Autosport article, Mark Hughes' column) that the solution was basically a duct that just sent it down to the diffuser like a pipe. Perhaps using the pickup points? Would've worked well with the A-spec RB8 exhausts.

But the one with the brake ducts confuses me as that theory gets thrown out of the water.
失败者找理由,成功者找方法

User avatar
Jackles-UK
17
Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:02 am

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

Yes it was exploiting a loophole Red Bull had spotted where the conical exclusion zone for bodywork behind the exhausts stopped around the front of the rear tyre. Scarbs suggested doing something similar-ish to this theory on his season rules preview this time last year.

Their plan was to combine some of the caught exhaust gases (with the expansion rate of the plume the amount actually harvested is up for discussion) the with high velocity air from the surroundings in a kind of funnel and channel them to the diffuser; maybe toward the edges similar to their 2011 EBD. This allowed them to be very accurate in channelling the gases to where they wanted and opened the possibility of an RB7-style exhaust exit solution (albeit far less effective).

User avatar
Gridlock
30
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 3:14 am

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

***Answered***

This is 1 of the 3 remaining teams I don't have an exact launch time for, if anyone can help please PM me or post here:

http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... 16#p405416

Cheers
#58

Coefficient
Coefficient
20
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2011 10:29 pm
Location: North West - UK

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

gilgen wrote:Why do posters keep posting old photos of past cars?
Some people think that the ability to use google makes them a hacker. LOL!
"I started out with nothing and I've still got most of it".

User avatar
matt21
86
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:17 pm

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

turbof1 wrote:Interesting. If I am correct, there has to be within a certain distance and radius of the exhaust exit, no bodywork. Could they have found a potentional loophole which could have allowed it anyway? And what do they mean with "absorbing"? Just a channel or something different?
In the actual rules is written that no bodywork has tu be in the cone up to the rear axle. Why are they not using their solution as it would have been located behind the axle as Newey said?

User avatar
raymondu999
54
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:31 am

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

matt21 wrote:
turbof1 wrote:Interesting. If I am correct, there has to be within a certain distance and radius of the exhaust exit, no bodywork. Could they have found a potentional loophole which could have allowed it anyway? And what do they mean with "absorbing"? Just a channel or something different?
In the actual rules is written that no bodywork has tu be in the cone up to the rear axle. Why are they not using their solution as it would have been located behind the axle as Newey said?
To memory, Newey said there was a TD that came out around November 2011 that practically illegalised his solution.
失败者找理由,成功者找方法

Raptor22
Raptor22
26
Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 9:48 pm

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

I agree with Newey, The current crop of designers are mediocre and hide behind restrictive rules to artificially level the playing field.
I would love to see what he comes up with by the time the RB9 lines up in Melbourne. One of the biggest attractions of the RedBull team is the ability to find loopholes, expoloit them and keep everybody guessing as to how the innovation works.
Probably a good thign for Ferrari that Rory Byrne is going to be back to help design the 0665 car. Another creative thinker is really needed in a top team

User avatar
Juzh
149
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 7:45 am

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

Just came across this bit of radio chatter:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1kBYzrfN00[/youtube]

What on earth is rocky on about with all those fail 5, fail 05, fail 14....?

User avatar
turbof1
Moderator
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:36 pm
Location: MountDoom CFD Matrix

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

That video image looks weird. It creates the illusion Vettel runs a different size of left tyre then the right one at the front.
#AeroFrodo

User avatar
Kiril Varbanov
147
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 2:00 pm
Location: Bulgaria, Sofia

Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

Post

Juzh wrote:Just came across this bit of radio chatter:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1kBYzrfN00

What on earth is rocky on about with all those fail 5, fail 05, fail 14....?
The "fail" pattern appears in the radio messages when some of the Sensors on the car doesn't work. Then, the driver has to press the corresponding number from his steering wheel - the +1 is on the right side, the -10 is on the left, as far as I remember. This is done to acknowledge the issue and to stop sending responses to the ECU.
Other teams have +10 and +1 buttons, which allows you to browse to the in-car data pages on the dash.