The "Shield" cockpit protection device - 2017 evolution

Here are our CFD links and discussions about aerodynamics, suspension, driver safety and tyres. Please stick to F1 on this forum.

What proposal would you back?

The Halo as proposed by Ferrari
4
3%
The small screen proposed by Red Bull
21
15%
The Proposed Shield
24
17%
None of the above
94
66%
 
Total votes: 143

Wigan301072
Wigan301072
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The "Shield" cockpit protection device - 2017 evolution

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So the FIA have dropped the ugly Halo Device (first proposed BT Ferrari) and the small almost moped looking screen (proposed by Red Bull), in favour of a new Shield design which in my opinion isn't a good idea...

Personally I am not in favour of any of these proposals. Either stay with Open Cockpits or go for an enclosed cockpit - I prefer the open cockpit concept.

The proposed shield will make racing in the rain even more difficult under its current proposed design (unless they add wind screen wipers that is). Plus while it may protect against small pieces of debris I struggle to see how it would cope with a wheel or how it would survive a serious crash? Plus if such a shield was smashed in a serious crash then surely the pieces of this proposed shield could endanger the driver!!!

I am interested in the views of everyone.

Just_a_fan
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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I think the halo device was first penned by Mercedes, not Ferrari.

As to what they should do, I'm not sure anything short of a full canopy will be worth doing. As we need to remember the Law of Unintended Consequences, any system is likely to cause an issue somewhere for one or other driver. So I'd say "leave the cars as they are now".
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wuzak
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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Wigan301072 wrote:
Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:58 pm
So the FIA have dropped the ugly Halo Device (first proposed BT Ferrari) and the small almost moped looking screen (proposed by Red Bull), in favour of a new Shield design which in my opinion isn't a good idea...

Personally I am not in favour of any of these proposals. Either stay with Open Cockpits or go for an enclosed cockpit - I prefer the open cockpit concept.

The proposed shield will make racing in the rain even more difficult under its current proposed design (unless they add wind screen wipers that is). Plus while it may protect against small pieces of debris I struggle to see how it would cope with a wheel or how it would survive a serious crash? Plus if such a shield was smashed in a serious crash then surely the pieces of this proposed shield could endanger the driver!!!

I am interested in the views of everyone.

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Vyssion
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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Wigan301072 wrote:
Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:58 pm
I am interested in the views of everyone.
My view is that the whole "we must do something!!" thing that is going on at the moment is a total and complete over reaction to "A FREAK ACCIDENT"... One driver dies within 20yrs since Senna's death due to an accident where he hit a front end loader which was only within the track limits to recover another car which they couldn't reach from outside the boundary, while under yellow flags which he seemingly didn't slow down for or react to, in a rain-soaked track at dusk with poor visibility on a corner which is known to be particularly tricky in the dark and rain etc etc etc etc....... It was a freak accident!!

Don't get me wrong here; I was a big fan of Bianchi and wanted to see him progress in F1. His Ferrari testing where he topped the charts whilst driving a better car was a testament to his skill, and it was cut short by a terrible accident that is unfair and unfortunate.

I just hate it when one thing happens, and everyone loses their sh*t over it. A halo doesn't totally protect from a spring that could fly off from a car and hit someone (Massa) in the head. Sure it reduces chances, but doesn't totally eliminate it. A screen might deflect it up and off (perhaps into a spectator or race marshal?). But what happens if a piano falls out of the sky cause someone forgot to tie it down properly in a cargo plane and it hits someone? Will we impose a ban on "open roof tracks" cause of this ONE freak accident?
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Oscar2603
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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Vyssion wrote:
Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:18 am
Wigan301072 wrote:
Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:58 pm
I am interested in the views of everyone.
My view is that the whole "we must do something!!" thing that is going on at the moment is a total and complete over reaction to "A FREAK ACCIDENT"... One driver dies within 20yrs since Senna's death due to an accident where he hit a front end loader which was only within the track limits to recover another car which they couldn't reach from outside the boundary, while under yellow flags which he seemingly didn't slow down for or react to, in a rain-soaked track at dusk with poor visibility on a corner which is known to be particularly tricky in the dark and rain etc etc etc etc....... It was a freak accident!!

Don't get me wrong here; I was a big fan of Bianchi and wanted to see him progress in F1. His Ferrari testing where he topped the charts whilst driving a better car was a testament to his skill, and it was cut short by a terrible accident that is unfair and unfortunate.

I just hate it when one thing happens, and everyone loses their sh*t over it. A halo doesn't totally protect from a spring that could fly off from a car and hit someone (Massa) in the head. Sure it reduces chances, but doesn't totally eliminate it. A screen might deflect it up and off (perhaps into a spectator or race marshal?). But what happens if a piano falls out of the sky cause someone forgot to tie it down properly in a cargo plane and it hits someone? Will we impose a ban on "open roof tracks" cause of this ONE freak accident?
Completely 100% agree with this.

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adrianjordan
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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What's more, I don't think any of these would have protected Bianchi. Wasn't it the rollhoop that connected with the crane? Certainly his brain injury was from the extreme deceleration, not deflecting off of the machinery.

Aren't these more aimed at protecting against flying wheels etc anyway??
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l4mbch0ps
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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adrianjordan wrote:
Wed May 03, 2017 9:35 pm
What's more, I don't think any of these would have protected Bianchi. Wasn't it the rollhoop that connected with the crane? Certainly his brain injury was from the extreme deceleration, not deflecting off of the machinery.

Aren't these more aimed at protecting against flying wheels etc anyway??
No, his injury was not from the deceleration. His helmet essentially hit the metal frame of the loader as his car went underneath it.

You are right though that none of these solutions would have saved Bianchi.

George-Jung
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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Massa, spring, Hungary...

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adrianjordan
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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l4mbch0ps wrote:
Wed May 03, 2017 9:43 pm
adrianjordan wrote:
Wed May 03, 2017 9:35 pm
What's more, I don't think any of these would have protected Bianchi. Wasn't it the rollhoop that connected with the crane? Certainly his brain injury was from the extreme deceleration, not deflecting off of the machinery.

Aren't these more aimed at protecting against flying wheels etc anyway??
No, his injury was not from the deceleration. His helmet essentially hit the metal frame of the loader as his car went underneath it.

You are right though that none of these solutions would have saved Bianchi.
Even then it's still the deceleration that caused his TBI. Essentially his brain hit his skull at however many mph.
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ChrisDanger
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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Wigan301072 wrote:
Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:58 pm
The proposed shield will make racing in the rain even more difficult under its current proposed design (unless they add wind screen wipers that is).
Because we all know jets have wipers (they don't!) and it's not possible to see in the rain with a helmet visor (it is!).

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Facts Only
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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George-Jung wrote:
Wed May 03, 2017 10:21 pm
Massa, spring, Hungary...
Henry Surtees, Justin Wilson, Dan Weldon.

The biggest cause of deaths in Single Seater racing these days is drivers being truck in the head with Debris and Track furniture. It's only right that something is being looked into. If we had the attitude of 'what we have is fine' the drivers would still be wearing leather hats and not being strapped in.
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J.A.W.
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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Facts Only wrote:
Sun May 07, 2017 3:01 pm
George-Jung wrote:
Wed May 03, 2017 10:21 pm
Massa, spring, Hungary...
Henry Surtees, Justin Wilson, Dan Weldon.

The biggest cause of deaths in Single Seater racing these days is drivers being truck in the head with Debris and Track furniture. It's only right that something is being looked into. If we had the attitude of 'what we have is fine' the drivers would still be wearing leather hats and not being strapped in.
Yeah, they've really gotta keep the trucks off/away from - the race track - when the G.P. is on..
I recall a line of Bugatti's - wherein he reckoned the big Bentley racers were virtually a bloody 'truck'..

How 'bout this one then? Not too subtle, is it? You could still see some of the driver - at least - when he's in it.
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& rain repelling windscreen treatments..
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ChrisDanger
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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You also have to consider that the reduction in visibility due to the shield will be negligible compared with the reduction in visibility due to the spray when following another car.

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Henne
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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For me, Formula 1 is an open wheel/open cockpit class. There will always be some sort of danger. If you want zero danger, start Simracing (I've been doing that for years). The only thing that can happen is you falling of your seat (never happened to me, and I'm still a rookie ;) ).

They can't stop people from getting injured in these freak accidents like Bianchi's or even Massa's. Look at MotoGP, those riders are in an even bigger danger, should we apply training wheels when the bike is over a certain degree so the riders won't fall off? They just know that's a great deal of their sport. And this is also the reason why so many people watch it. They know its a bit dangerous and they know that the lucky few can get in this class and race against the best, on the edge.

This is the same formula in many sports. There is a certain Pro level, and that involves a certain part of danger. Pro's will cover 80% of that danger by their skill. 19% is controlled by other security measures, 1% is unknown territory. And in this 1% we've had unlucky incidents.

I'm glad that they improved on safety after 1994, most things have improved on the safety aspect, but for me this is an open wheel/open cockpit class. Leave it like that. If F1 racers want a closed cockpit and similar speeds, they will go and look at WEC (which is spectacular as well, its just another series).

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mclaren111
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Re: The "Shield" to protect drivers?

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Henne wrote:
Mon May 08, 2017 1:39 pm
For me, Formula 1 is an open wheel/open cockpit class. There will always be some sort of danger. If you want zero danger, start Simracing (I've been doing that for years). The only thing that can happen is you falling of your seat (never happened to me, and I'm still a rookie ;) ).

They can't stop people from getting injured in these freak accidents like Bianchi's or even Massa's. Look at MotoGP, those riders are in an even bigger danger, should we apply training wheels when the bike is over a certain degree so the riders won't fall off? They just know that's a great deal of their sport. And this is also the reason why so many people watch it. They know its a bit dangerous and they know that the lucky few can get in this class and race against the best, on the edge.

This is the same formula in many sports. There is a certain Pro level, and that involves a certain part of danger. Pro's will cover 80% of that danger by their skill. 19% is controlled by other security measures, 1% is unknown territory. And in this 1% we've had unlucky incidents.

I'm glad that they improved on safety after 1994, most things have improved on the safety aspect, but for me this is an open wheel/open cockpit class. Leave it like that. If F1 racers want a closed cockpit and similar speeds, they will go and look at WEC (which is spectacular as well, its just another series).
Agree 200%