2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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El Scorchio
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Mogster wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:17 pm
El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:05 pm
RZS10 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:33 pm


There was never anything more than "maybe we could extend the circuit onto Le Portier"

From a 2015 Forbes article:


From 2018 in Forbes quoting Prince Albert II:




Route some of the track "into" the water, make it alternate randomly between being submerged by like 2 cm and just being wet - take F1 aquaplaning to a whole new level.

I'm collecting all the ideas and will shoot the FIA/Liberty and the Prince a mail with some drawings/photoshops :^)
They just need to manufacture ONE point on the circuit where a car reasonably faster than the one in front of it can have a good go at an overtake. I think that would breathe a whole new heap of life into it as a race. There would still be the great challenge of following closely enough over the rest of the lap to set yourself up for it.

Easier said than done at Monaco, though. There just isn't the opportunity to make a straight long enough or straight enough. Would removing the nouvelle chicane have any positive effect whatsoever? (If it's even possible)
From satellite view there are other roads that could be used. Monaco is bigger than just the waterfront area where the current track is.

The Portier Cove land reclamation doesn’t seem large enough to provide a decent section for overtaking unfortunately.
Oh, I do realise that, but I was thinking of the smallest possible modifications to the existing layout. If you change it too much then you might as well not race there.

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El Scorchio
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Just_a_fan wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:20 pm
El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:05 pm

They just need to manufacture ONE point on the circuit where a car reasonably faster than the one in front of it can have a good go at an overtake. I think that would breathe a whole new heap of life into it as a race. There would still be the great challenge of following closely enough over the rest of the lap to set yourself up for it.

Easier said than done at Monaco, though. There just isn't the opportunity to make a straight long enough or straight enough. Would removing the nouvelle chicane have any positive effect whatsoever? (If it's even possible)
The only place would be to extend the run from the tunnel. Scrap the chicane and move it further along the Ave JF Kennedy.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.7370289 ... 312!8i6656

Probably need to take out a couple of trees too. It wouldn't be much extra straight but it might work. It would be very narrow, however so extremely easy to block by just driving near the middle of the track. That could be solved by removing all of the trees along there but that's probably not going to go down well with the locals. It also would make Tabac a much slower corner and affect the speed in to the swimming pool complex.

Other than that, you'd need to totally change the circuit and go driving around the streets away from the water front.

The reality is that F1 doesn't work at Monaco in terms of racing. Great to see the cars being hustled in qualifying (no one argues with that, I'm sure), but the race is usually dull, dull, dull.
Yes, I thought the drawback would be that it would be so narrow it would be probably too easy to defend. And you're right- I'm not sure the locals would accept any changes to their home, and I fully see their point of view. After all the place is only 'ours' for three days a year!

UlleGulle
UlleGulle
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:05 pm
RZS10 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:33 pm
214270 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:18 pm


Can you link to it pls?, I’d like to read up on it. Thanks
There was never anything more than "maybe we could extend the circuit onto Le Portier"

From a 2015 Forbes article:
The most exciting development is for the racing fraternity of Formula One, utilizing the new land to create a new section of track, leading from the downhill Portier to a new section with wide road and a tight hairpin, creating an overtaking spot. The track would then rejoin the original circuit just before the tunnel, thus cutting the speed at which cars go through and reducing the dangers of the confined area.
From 2018 in Forbes quoting Prince Albert II:
We always look, every once in a while, at different possibilities of extending the track, and certainly something to think about is that we are building the new land extension. There are no plans or anything yet, it is just in the back of all of our minds — people in the Automobile Club but also in the government — that there could be. I am not saying that it will happen necessarily, but at some point we are going to put our minds together and say, how can we not only improve this, but how can we make it a little more exciting by maybe changing the course slightly? We haven’t gone beyond this simple statement of an idea — something that is in the back of our minds.
jjn9128 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:32 pm

Bernie’s sprinkler idea should be revisited
Route some of the track "into" the water, make it alternate randomly between being submerged by like 2 cm and just being wet - take F1 aquaplaning to a whole new level.

I'm collecting all the ideas and will shoot the FIA/Liberty and the Prince a mail with some drawings/photoshops :^)
They just need to manufacture ONE point on the circuit where a car reasonably faster than the one in front of it can have a good go at an overtake. I think that would breathe a whole new heap of life into it as a race. There would still be the great challenge of following closely enough over the rest of the lap to set yourself up for it.

Easier said than done at Monaco, though. There just isn't the opportunity to make a straight long enough or straight enough. Would removing the nouvelle chicane have any positive effect whatsoever? (If it's even possible)
I think that entry into Tabac would be dangerously fast, sadly. Because that would be epic.

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El Scorchio
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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UlleGulle wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:33 pm
El Scorchio wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:05 pm
RZS10 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 12:33 pm


There was never anything more than "maybe we could extend the circuit onto Le Portier"

From a 2015 Forbes article:


From 2018 in Forbes quoting Prince Albert II:




Route some of the track "into" the water, make it alternate randomly between being submerged by like 2 cm and just being wet - take F1 aquaplaning to a whole new level.

I'm collecting all the ideas and will shoot the FIA/Liberty and the Prince a mail with some drawings/photoshops :^)
They just need to manufacture ONE point on the circuit where a car reasonably faster than the one in front of it can have a good go at an overtake. I think that would breathe a whole new heap of life into it as a race. There would still be the great challenge of following closely enough over the rest of the lap to set yourself up for it.

Easier said than done at Monaco, though. There just isn't the opportunity to make a straight long enough or straight enough. Would removing the nouvelle chicane have any positive effect whatsoever? (If it's even possible)
I think that entry into Tabac would be dangerously fast, sadly. Because that would be epic.
That is also true- literally no runoff area either, in case it's misjudged. You could cause a very big pile up in a confined space.

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Sieper
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Well, see F2 and Porsche cup. Major pile ups. That isn’t stopping them.
Controversy does not have a short memory.

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Artur Craft
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Schuttelberg wrote:
Sun May 23, 2021 4:37 pm
Two poor races from Hamilton in five. It's fair to say that Verstappen is leading the championship in an inferior car. But, expect the narrative to remain that Mercedes is slower!
Yeah, you´re smart. This narrative is never ending....

Still, I´m scratching my head to Ricciardo´s speed in the Mclaren. I thought he would immediately show up Norris, as Sainz did.

Did not expect Alonso to struggle against Ocon either, regardless of his age and time away of F1.

Tsunoda is also performing way worse than I expected at this point, which is sad.

The only new driver to a team/rookie that is impressing me and showing great speed is Mick, which is surprising to me because I didn´t expect much from him, especially on his first year

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SiLo
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Artur Craft wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:54 pm
Schuttelberg wrote:
Sun May 23, 2021 4:37 pm
Two poor races from Hamilton in five. It's fair to say that Verstappen is leading the championship in an inferior car. But, expect the narrative to remain that Mercedes is slower!
Yeah, you´re smart. This narrative is never ending....

Still, I´m scratching my head to Ricciardo´s speed in the Mclaren. I thought he would immediately show up Norris, as Sainz did.

Did not expect Alonso to struggle against Ocon either, regardless of his age and time away of F1.

Tsunoda is also performing way worse than I expected at this point, which is sad.

The only new driver to a team/rookie that is impressing me and showing great speed is Mick, which is surprising to me because I didn´t expect much from him, especially on his first year
To be honest, this weekend just seemed weird. I don't imagine we have many more like it this year.
Felipe Baby!

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Artur Craft
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Yeah, too much poor performances this weekend. I hope they improve, don´t wanna see people slow or crashing in Baku. They should see Vettel as a role model, someone who is already showing great progress.

aMessageToCharlie
aMessageToCharlie
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Diesel wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:14 pm
Schuttelberg wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 8:15 am
The journalist isn't creating any drama. May be you need to view it with more balance. When asked if there were any learnings he clearly says they're all for the team and none for him.

Let's just say that the team did ask him to go a certain route with set up, then one has to say that over the past eight years Mercedes must have done that often? How often have they been right and got Lewis a win?

You win and lose as a team. In his case, it's often this narrative that when they win it's a team effort but when they lose its just the team. It doesn't work like that. He could have won in Imola had he not put it in the kitty litter. He could have qualified better here like his team mate showed. Also, while Max is 23 and much much more raw, he conducted himself very well with Charles being in the wall. I can show you how Lewis has reacted at the same venue when he couldn't complete a lap against his championship rival?

Some people cannot accept losing and that is fine. The issue at hand is the choice of convenience where all great things are mostly down to him but he isn't to blame when it goes pear shaped. For a seven times world champion to say that about a team that has given him a championship winning car every year bar one is pretty low and shallow as far as I am concerned.
I've watched all of the interviews for balance, and overall his tone is that as a team they didn't perform this weekend, and he is quite clearly including his own performance in that statement. The "questions" from Dutch TV are obviously trying to provoke a response and they are absolutely about drama, that's what they want as it makes for good TV. The first few questions aren't even questions, just statements about how bad Hamilton's weekend has been, if that's not creating drama what is? They were trying to ruffle his feathers, and they succeeded it seems.

But hey, if you want to take some fairly short answers he provided in response to an interview from Dutch TV (the nationality of his rival) which was clearly intended to provoke a response from him and turn it in to a narrative of "not a team player", go for it :wtf:

I would say Lewis certainly got a taste of his own medicine, he was making some fairly silly comments in the media during the weekend clearly trying to play some mind games with Max. After having a disaster of a weekend, very quickly it's all turned back on him.
What about this one? Do you think Will Buxton is also in on this dutch plot?



"poor... Really, really poor performance from the team."

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jjn9128
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 1:00 pm
Or random power cuts to the tunnel lights.
Even better, strobe lights for 4/5 "rave laps" in the tunnel - to keep the kids interested. Maybe they can vote on when it happens via twitter :lol:
#aerogandalf
"There is one big friend. It is downforce. And once you have this it’s a big mate and it’s helping a lot." Robert Kubica

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Sieper
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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That whole insinuation about Dutch TV was off the bat. Normally it is the slightly idiotic Jack Plooij doing the interviews but he is down with Corona (recovered but still testing positive) so now it is long time ziggo race reporter Rick Winkelman doing the interviews. Rick is sensible, respectfull and does many, many race classes. I have never heard him talk bad about any driver. Never name calling, nothing. He had been nothing but respect to all drivers. Is well informed. That slightly awkward end was just his inexperience (he had been pit reporter, but long ago) with the proceedings.
Controversy does not have a short memory.

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jjn9128
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Di Grassi's solutions:

#aerogandalf
"There is one big friend. It is downforce. And once you have this it’s a big mate and it’s helping a lot." Robert Kubica

SmallSoldier
SmallSoldier
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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AnthonyG wrote:
UlleGulle wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 9:55 am
We always hear that Monaco is "unfixable", but I have come to think that the real problem is the nouvelle chicane. Other than being too artificial and being the only part of the track that doesn't punish mistakes it's also near impossible to go two cars aside through. I have two humble propositions to fix it.

1. Super Easy Fix: Move the apexes 1-2 meters away from the seaside. Insert a DRS-zone between the chicane and Tabac, with the detection point at the exit of the tunnel. A car covering the inside in NC will have to yield the inside on Tabac with very little opportunity to take the position back.

2. Harder fix: Remove the Nouvelle Chicane, and lead cars directly onto the Quai des Etats-Unis. Insert a new chicane at Port Palace Hotel, going to the Aveneu JF. Kennedy and back again. Insert a DRS-zone if possible. Will need to chop down some tree's though.

Tire management snoozefests are always the consequence of lack of overtaking possibilities. So by fixing that, better races will follow.
Easiest fix is to make the cars smallers. These things are just way too big, I don't see the point. Fans don't want a seven metre obese behemoth.
On top of that smaller cars create extra opportunities on every track the circus visits.
The problem isn’t as much how big the cars are (you can still go 2 wide at several spots)... The problem is how fast they are.

The speed of the cars make the “straights” too short to make an overtake attempt... If you add to it that the brakes on these cars are ridiculously good and therefore the braking zones are super short you are not going to have overtakes.

The cars are just too quick for Monaco when it comes to overtakes.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Remove the front wings and barge boards. Cars will be 5 seconds a lap slower. Braking distance will be terrible. Don't worry about car width, they can smash sidewalls to get past.

Anyway, another rubbish mickey mouse race. I think Redbul have 1 point lead in the WCC now. I thought that the Merc is leading the WCC so its the fastest car? haha.
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NathanOlder
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Re: 2021 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 20 - 23

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Talking of car sizes, It's crazy how the current F1 cars are wider than a Range Rover, and close to 1 metre longer than a Range Rover!!! This is insane!
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